Ceroc Champs 2004

[Mary]

Just thought you might like to know, I've just had a reply to my email query about this years' Ceroc Champs. It is planned for May, and there should be more news over the next couple of days, contracts permitting.

If anyone hears any more let us all know.:cheers:

So who's going in for it his year?

M

[Will]

I've heard that its going to be in the Palais again on the usual 1st bank holiday weekend in May. So I'm relieved it's going ahead....

....just make sure that no-one tells Travis about it this time! :angry:

[Jayne]

Originally posted by Will
I've heard that its going to be in the Palais again on the usual 1st bank holiday weekend in May. So I'm relieved it's going ahead....
I heard that it was in a different venue this year so I was contemplating going - but if it's in the Palais again....

J *sigh*

[Yogi_Bear]

I heard that there wasn't going to be one this year as there would be problems in finding a satisfactory venue.

[Debster]

Originally posted by Yogi_Bear
I heard that there wasn't going to be one this year as there would be problems in finding a satisfactory venue.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Of course the venue will probably be sh^$£(&^%*~~@## ! But don't scare me like that!

Mary had better be getting reliable info... my year is pinned around this date/comp - wow, how sad is that?? :wink:


who is Travis?

[Bill]

Bit late to get things organised isn't it ??

The Palais is a dreadful venue which is why we all thought they were changing it. Poor visibility, cramped dancefloor etc. The only reason I went last year was because of the Open category.

Be interesting to hear officially. If it si the same venue whta was all the delay for ??:confused:

[Jayne]

Originally posted by Bill
The Palais is a dreadful venue
Agree completely.

J

[filthycute]

Originally posted by Bill
The Palais is a dreadful venue

This is why i didn't go last year and have no intention of going this year. I had heard they were getting a new venue but until it actually happens i won't be in London.

filthycute x x

[Mary]

Have to agree that the Palais is the pits. I never get to see anything 'cos I'm only 5'2" and the rest of the world is taller than me!!:tears: and viewing areas are very limited. AND the changing room is so dark you can't even tell if yer knickers are on the right way round!! BUT maybe, better to have that than nothing at all.

I guess all will be revealed very soon.

M

[Gus]

Originally posted by Mary
Have to agree that the Palais is the pits.BUT maybe, better to have that than nothing at all.


Hey ... here's an idea ... What about the Ceroc champs being held up North ... plenty of great venues, loads of friendly people etc . etc. ... you know the North ... where all the good football teams are:wink: apologies to any Spurs fans:D

[Bill]

Originally posted by Mary
AND the changing room is so dark you can't even tell if yer knickers are on the right way round!! BUT maybe, better to have that than nothing at all.

I guess all will be revealed very soon.

M


:rofl: :D ... Yep... it is that dark. MAybe one of the few advantages of a thong then. Can't really get them round the wrong way :rolleyes: But at a comp you really need your good big dance pants eh !!!!!!!

Remember and pack a torch this year Mary....:na: :whistle:

[Mary]

Originally posted by Bill
:rofl: :D ... Yep... it is that dark. MAybe one of the few advantages of a thong then. Can't really get them round the wrong way :rolleyes: But at a comp you really need your good big dance pants eh !!!!!!!

Remember and pack a torch this year Mary....:na: :whistle:



But only if I'm going to be wearing big knickers!!

M

[Bill]

Originally posted by Mary
But only if I'm going to be wearing big knickers!!

M

now you're just teasing. I'll be watching any aerials you do VERY closely !!!:na: :innocent:

[Heather]

Originally posted by Gus
Hey ... here's an idea ... What about the Ceroc champs being held up North ... plenty of great venues, loads of friendly people etc . etc. ... you know the North . [/i]


BRILLIANT idea Gus!!!! But somehow I don't think it will happen, those Southerners are notoriously bad at moving outwith London, they don't saeem to realise that civilisation actually DOES exist North of the Watford Gap!!!!!:rofl: First and last time for me at the Ceroc Champs last year, Hammersmith is a dump !!!

:hug:
Heather,
XX

[Gus]

Originally posted by Heather
First and last time for me at the Ceroc Champs last year, Hammersmith is a dump !!!


Must admit I concur ... been 3 time, the last time I left before the finals .... no room to dance, dangerous on the floor and some 'interesting' decisions. After Blackpool, no comparison in the event itself. Its a shame as there are obviously some very good competitors and dancers ... but wasted on the venue.

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Heather
those Southerners are notoriously bad at moving outwith London, Thanks Heather, see you at Blackpool? :hug:

Greg

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Jayne
I heard that it was in a different venue this year so I was contemplating going - but if it's in the Palais again.... I said right after the last one that I wouldn't go to Hammersmith again, so I'm with you on that one.

Trouble is, if it's on 2nd May, I'm already booked that evening, I suppose I could just make the reasonable assumption that I wouldn't make it to the finals anyway, so won't need to stay after 7pm!

Greg

[Emma]

Originally posted by Will
I've heard that its going to be in the Palais again on the usual 1st bank holiday weekend in May. So I'm relieved it's going ahead....Yeah me too...granted the Palais is not an ideal venue (er..and it hasn't actually been confirmed that it's there yet, has it?!) but I'd rather go to the Champs at a less-than-perfect venue than not be able to go at all. For me it's the people that make the event and I would rather be with my friends (and all those potential new friends!) than not have it at all. C'mon guys, find the good in it! (Just call me Pollyanna :flower: :rofl: )

[Heather]

:D POLLYANNA !!!!!!:rofl:

:hug:
(You MAd woman YOU !!!!!)
Heather,
XX

[Graham W]

..and it seems to be run by the Hamm mafia - left a pair of dance shoes there one year and phoned up to be told that the only lost property found was a 'ladies handbag' - yeah right - how many people were there and thats all that was left!!?
Not the fault of CeRoc but it sucks...

G

..but I'll probably there for the intensity of the occassion - football players dont choose where they play - why be so fussy if u wanna compete?

[Jon L]

For future years The champs should be held somewhere around Birmingham IMO.

The reason for this is that it means that our friends North of the Border and indeed those North of Watford don't have so far to come.

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Jon L
For future years The champs should be held somewhere around Birmingham IMO.

The reason for this is that it means that our friends North of the Border and indeed those North of Watford don't have so far to come. But it's probably cheaper, and just as easy, to come down from Scotland to London, as it is from Scotland to Birmingham. Since we're probably going to fly anyhow. I'm guessing that there's more flights to London - and if we get enough notice, we can get the cheap flights.

And I'd guess that the majority of the people at the champs are from in or around London (and would this change if you moved them to Birmingham?). Should you penalise the many, to attempt to benefit the few?

I think that they probably should be in London. But it would be nice if they were in a better venue. Thanks for trying to think of us though Jon.

Steve

[Bill]

Originally posted by Jon L
For future years The champs should be held somewhere around Birmingham IMO.

The reason for this is that it means that our friends North of the Border and indeed those North of Watford don't have so far to come.


Lovely thought John, but as Steve points out it's just as quick and cheap for us to get to London as it is to Birmingham.

There must be a decent sized venue somewhere in London. I really would think twice about going down to the Palais again even if it meant I could dance with lots of Forumites because there is so little room to dance and at times it feels very dangerous.

If the Scottish teams enter then I might go and support them but undecided at the moment.

[DavidB]

There are plenty of large venues in London - Grosvenor House Hotel in Park Lane, Paragon Hotel in Fulham, even the Royal Albert Hall are all used for major ballroom dance competitions. A bit further out is the International Hall in Brentwood (Essex).

They probably cost a bit though...

David

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Emma
For me it's the people that make the event and I would rather be with my friends (and all those potential new friends!) Absolutely, roll on the BFG, RBs, Beach Boogie, etc, etc.

Greg

[Yogi_Bear]

So, if there is to be a (London) ceroc championships this year, why isn't there anything on the main ceroc website about it yet? Word has it there won't be one anyway...

[Graham W]

Birmingham sounds a good idea...:-)

2nd biggest city & all that..

G

No other reason to go ther thu ..

[Gareth]

I agree with you Graham, but there again anywhere is better than Hammersmith:D

[Tazmanian Devil]

Originally posted by Emma
Yeah me too...granted the Palais is not an ideal venue (er..and it hasn't actually been confirmed that it's there yet, has it?!) but I'd rather go to the Champs at a less-than-perfect venue than not be able to go at all. For me it's the people that make the event and I would rather be with my friends (and all those potential new friends!) than not have it at all. C'mon guys, find the good in it! (Just call me Pollyanna :flower: :rofl: )
:yeah: Had an e-mail the other day about the champs it's supposed to be on the 2nd may (sorry sheepy) at Hammersmith palais. The application forms are supposed to be out next week. :flower: :kiss: :hug:

[Tiggerbabe]

Originally posted by Tazmanian Devil
:yeah: Had an e-mail the other day about the champs it's supposed to be on the 2nd may (sorry sheepy) at Hammersmith palais. The application forms are supposed to be out next week. :flower: :kiss: :hug:
Hurrah!!!!!!!

[Mary]

Originally posted by Tazmanian Devil
:yeah: Had an e-mail the other day about the champs it's supposed to be on the 2nd may (sorry sheepy) at Hammersmith palais. The application forms are supposed to be out next week. :flower: :kiss: :hug:

At last!! Thanks Taz. See you there then.

M

[fruitcake]

Originally posted by Bill
:rofl: :D ... Yep... it is that dark. MAybe one of the few advantages of a thong then. Can't really get them round the wrong way :rolleyes: But at a comp you really need your good big dance pants eh !!!!!!!
:

Hmmm! YOu've obviously never worn a thong then!!!!!


Or are guys ones bigger at the front?:rofl:

[RobC]

Originally posted by Mary
At last!! Thanks Taz. See you there then.
Well unless someone has taken a shotgun to the palais management and sacked all the bouncers, you won't see me back at the Palais.

I had enough of the place when LeJive used to run their competitions there, but had my arm twisted into going again last year to do a repeat performance of our double trouble routine - more fool me. Making us queue half way up the high street while bouncers search bags confiscating any food or drink was not a great start to the day.....

A dance competition is an energetic athletic event of significant duration. Any athlete worth their salt would always go to such an event loaded with suitable energy drinks and high energy food. To be told we can't take that crucial nutrition into the venue where the only provided alternative is poor (and very expensive) redbull-imitation and burger and chips is unaccaptable !!! :mad: :angry: :mad:

Come on Ceroc - if you are going to run a competition, treat it like one and not a night club event where you are trying to pack as many people through the door as possible and then fleece them for all the money in their wallet. If you insist on using the Palais, please give us some reassurance that we will be allowed to take our own food and drink into the venue this year.

Rob

[RobC]

Originally posted by DavidB
There are plenty of large venues in London - Grosvenor House Hotel in Park Lane, Paragon Hotel in Fulham, even the Royal Albert Hall are all used for major ballroom dance competitions. A bit further out is the International Hall in Brentwood (Essex).


:yeah: I seem to remember that the Student National Ballroom competition was held in the Savoy Ballroom at the Grosvenor House Hotel back in 1993. It was a fantastic venue with a very large dance floor, loads of space around the edges of the dance floor for tables and seating, and a balcony all around the venue for further viewing opportunities. I haven't been back there since then, but I'm sure it's still an excellent venue.

Rob

[Jayne]

Originally posted by Tazmanian Devil
Had an e-mail the other day about the champs it's supposed to be on the 2nd may (sorry sheepy) at Hammersmith palais. The application forms are supposed to be out next week.
*sigh* Once again there is a poor decision at the Ceroc Champs.....

So the question now is going to be - just how good is our resolve? Will we stick to our guns and avoid this comp because 1) the organisers have so little respect for their customers and 2) IT'S A DIRE VENUE (IMHO, of course).

Or will we all give in to peer pressure again and trundle along because we're too addicted to miss a dance event?

I'm hoping for the former.

J
*sigh*

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Jayne
So the question now is going to be - just how good is our resolve? Well right now I'm saying I shall save myself for other things, eg (if the injuries heal) Britroc - great venue, excellent organisation, and (not that this really matters to 99.9% of us) great prizes.

But I will be free for the pre competition party! (What pre competition party :confused: )

Greg

[Dan Hudson]

Originally posted by Jayne
*sigh* Once again there is a poor decision at the Ceroc Champs.....

So the question now is going to be - just how good is our resolve? Will we stick to our guns and avoid this comp because 1) the organisers have so little respect for their customers and 2) IT'S A DIRE VENUE (IMHO, of course).

J
*sigh*

Jayne

I don't think you guys realise how much money a large dance venue in London costs!! Or how far in advance they need to be booked. Some venues are booked up 2-3 years in advance!!!
its not just the hall hire, there is sound systems, certified dance floors, security, ticketing, promotions and some venues in london you have to bring in your own seating, tables etc etc. Not as cut and dry as people think.

If the ticket prices went up because of a different venue I am sure you will all complain about that

I agree that the Palais is not the best venue in town, but surely its the people that go that make it a good day??

Please don't take this as a personal attack, its not and also please don't think that I don't agree that the palais is not the best, but for the moment it is the venue that has been arranged therefore we should all give it some support.

I think the champs has been great over the years and everyone always has a good time, so lets start to be a little more positive.

Dan
:clap: :clap: :cheers:

[Debster]

OK, we all know the venue sucks - even the guys who run the comp I suspect - I have done my fair share of complaining in the past too - but boycotting won't help it I imagine (apart from making more space for those who do go)

The ballroom comp venues listed are way too expensive - and I'm sure NOT an option. Grosvenor House?? Hooley dooley man!

You apparently don't realise how expensive ballroom is in comparison to Ceroc. It's a universe of expense out of our league... and AMEN - Thank heavens for that too! Let's keep it that way.

Boycotting the Palias will only make it look like a comp in London is a bad idea and it won't be moved for following years - just cancelled.

Let's look on the bright side - at least we will have a comp - YAY! :) - someone will organise it for us (even if not to our exact hopes and plans) which is no small task :) - and we get to have fun with our friends :D :D .

We should be prepared to leave food and drink at the front door - yep, that kind of sucks too - but at least last year I could leave it there and go out for some peace and quiet to eat it - maybe a few chairs would be nice so I don't have to sit on the floor again - but heck - could have been worse!

[Bill]

But...........Debster and Dan...............you possibly forget how expensive it is for those of us up north to get down for the weekend.

I didn't think London was that bad the first year I went as it was all so new - although I didn't dance too much because it was so busy.

What has happened is that we have been 'spoiled' by Blackpool. The venue and atmosphere are far superior and if I'm going to spend a few hundered pounds on flights, trains, B &B etc... then I expect a decent venue.

I heard almost immediately after last years event that it would be moving this year so the organisers have had a year to look and plan. At least last year they limited the numbers a little so there was some breathing space but it's still a poor venue for such a major event.

And yes, the people can make the event but if you spend most of the time watching dancers around you or being kicked and jostled then it doesn't make it an enjoyable day.

The event was very well organised last year and we all realise how expensive a venue can be - which raises the question of whether it has to be in the middle of London.

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by Dan Hudson
I don't think you guys realise how much money a large dance venue in London costs!! Or how far in advance they need to be booked. Some venues are booked up 2-3 years in advance!!!

hmm thats a big assumption for you to make, and slightly patronising too. Hammersmith is a very poor venue indeed for the Ceroc champs, you breaking down the cost into individual units doesn't alter that fact.


Originally posted by Dan Hudson

If the ticket prices went up because of a different venue I am sure you will all complain about that


Another assumption, I expect you'd get lots of compliments about the improved venue along with any about a price increase. You cant please all of the people all of the time, but you'll never get all of them to agree on what to complain about.



Originally posted by Dan Hudson

I agree that the Palais is not the best venue in town, but surely its the people that go that make it a good day??

Too crowded to dance with them in freestyle bits, or watch them when they're competing! I went 3 years ago and have no intention of going back till the venue improves, maybe thats just me though. If you do get a good spot and dont mind not getting to dance with people, at least its central-ish. :)

[Emma]

Originally posted by Bill
Lovely thought John, but as Steve points out it's just as quick and cheap for us to get to London as it is to Birmingham.

Originally posted by Bill
But...........Debster and Dan...............you possibly forget how expensive it is for those of us up north to get down for the weekend.:confused:

The point is, wherever the Champs is held, it is going to be expensive for someone to get to. It's extremely expensive for me to get to Aberdeen, for instance. Wherever the event is held, someone is likely to be put out by it's location.

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Emma
:confused:
The point is, wherever the Champs is held, it is going to be expensive for someone to get to. It's extremely expensive for me to get to Aberdeen, for instance. Wherever the event is held, someone is likely to be put out by it's location. I don't think that was the point that was being made though Emma.

I think that the point being made was, it's going to cost lots of money, so while it's being held in a sub-standard venue, then people aren't going to be happy paying what it's going to cost, to come, and not enjoy the day.

I'm sure that people wouldn't mention the cost if they thought that the venue was value for money.

I expect that I'll be there though!!! :cheers:

Steve

[Tiggerbabe]

Originally posted by Jayne
*sigh* Will we stick to our guns and avoid this comp /snip/..............Or will we all give in to peer pressure again
I don't really see that peer pressure has much to do with it - surely the decision to attend or not is down to the individual, decided by many factors.........can I afford to go? do I want to go?being two of them.
If you hate the venue that much, then you don't go - simple.

I'm sure there are a lot of people who don't make it to Blackpool, from further South, because it's more expensive for them to go to than a competition held closer to home.

[Emma]

Originally posted by TheTramp
I don't think that was the point that was being made though Emma. Umm...it was the point I was making though Steve, following on from the earlier discussion about why the event is held in London :nice:

Obviously there are many factors in deciding whether to attend a competition - travel costs, accommodation, food, your friends, your chances of fame and fortune in the Ceroc world ( :rofl: ). Each to their own...but I do think it's a shame that some people are suggesting boycotting the event just because of the venue.

[David Franklin]

Originally posted by TheTramp
I don't think that was the point that was being made though Emma.

I think that the point being made was, it's going to cost lots of money, so while it's being held in a sub-standard venue, then people aren't going to be happy paying what it's going to cost, to come, and not enjoy the day.

I'm sure that people wouldn't mention the cost if they thought that the venue was value for money.:yeah: The other related point is that the supply/demand curve is likely to be quite different depending on whether you live near London. If you're travelling 400 miles to compete, and spending 200 pounds on transport/accomodation, paying a few quid extra to make sure there's space for dancing is well worth it. It's probably a harder sell to the local Londoners...

Dave

[Bill]

Originally posted by Emma
:confused:

The point is, wherever the Champs is held, it is going to be expensive for someone to get to. It's extremely expensive for me to get to Aberdeen, for instance. Wherever the event is held, someone is likely to be put out by it's location.

But Emma............you'll be dancing at the Beach Ballroom which has a wonderful sprung floor and have room to dance and even watch people if you have time to sit down :D

I don't mind the expense of going to Blackpool (and it can be more time consuming and more expensive than London) but the venue, the atmosphere, the space is just so much better.

If it hadn't been for the Open category I wouldn't have been there last year and we haven't decided whether we'll go this year.

[Gus]

Originally posted by Dan Hudson
Jayne

I don't think you guys realise how much money a large dance venue in London costs!!

I think the champs has been great over the years and everyone always has a good time, so lets start to be a little more positive.


[ODA Mode On}
Why?? To echo Tramps words .... the Ceroc Champs (IMHO) don't match up to the new wave of competitions. Good competitors ... but the same level (if not better) of competition can be seen at Blackpool, BritRoc etc with more room to dance, better facilties and less partisan judges (:devil: ). If the Londerners want to have some Champs ... fine ... but lets start calling it the South East Champs .... cause a lot of us yokels in the sticks may not think its worth the hassle and cost to attend.
[ODA Mode Off}

OK ... its not maybe as bad as that but I've attended three Champs and being dissapointed 3 times ... the last time (2002) I left before the finals because I simply felt too hemmed in and could be bothered to fight my way onto an already packed dancefloor.

[Brady]

Originally posted by Dan Hudson
I think the champs has been great over the years and everyone always has a good time, so lets start to be a little more positive.

Dan
:clap: :clap: :cheers:

Obviously the feedback questionnaires were only filled out by the select group who enjoyed themselves. I went 2 years ago and the best dancing I had was during our two performances of our team cabaret. I tried getting on the floor and even stage for some freestyle, but found it completely impossible. I didn't go last year and won't be going this year due to this poor venue. I was really hoping that the 'new' Ceroc would make some improvements to not only their classes, but also the champs, but so far it just seems to be a bunch of ideas.

Brady

[Chris]

Originally posted by Brady
I was really hoping that the 'new' Ceroc would make some improvements to not only their classes, but also the champs, but so far it just seems to be a bunch of ideas.
No doubt they will have seen the general criticism over conditions at Hammersmith. But given the lead time necessary for organising events in London usually, we could also say the new team haven't had time to make these sort of changes yet. Central London is a big bonus in many ways but it was probably booked a long time in advance, before the present lot took over.

[Jayne]

Originally posted by Dan Hudson
Jayne

I don't think you guys realise how much money a large dance venue in London costs!! Or how far in advance they need to be booked. Some venues are booked up 2-3 years in advance!!!
its not just the hall hire, there is sound systems, certified dance floors, security, ticketing, promotions and some venues in london you have to bring in your own seating, tables etc etc. Not as cut and dry as people think.

Dan,

with due respect I do appreciate how much effort goes into organising something like this. At uni I was only loosely involved in Ballroom comps and even then I saw that it took a huge amount of effort from a whole team to pull off such an event.

However, I have also worked in positions where you have to deal with customers. In that situation you have to ensure that your customers are getting the quality of service they expect. If they are not then you have to do all you can to change things. I don't feel that the organisers of the London comp are doing this and this is why I said that I don't think that they treat their customers with a great deal of respect. People have been saying for years that the Palais is a poor venue - this hasn't just happened overnight.

Having said that though I actually have a great deal of respect for David and the London ceroc champs team. I had a fair amount of contact with David last year as I took a cabaret team down to the comp. He did a great job of getting things organised, helping us out, answering questions, rearranging things on the day when we ran into problems etc etc. They do a great job - if only they could get a better venue!



If the ticket prices went up because of a different venue I am sure you will all complain about that

IMHO this is a very weak argument. Most of the expense goes on transport, hotel costs, hall hire for practice before the comp, outfits... An extra fiver on the entry cost ensuring a great venue with was room to dance would be minimal IMHO.



Please don't take this as a personal attack

ditto



I think the champs has been great over the years and everyone always has a good time so lets start to be a little more positive.

I don't want to be a pedant here, but looking at other people's comments on this thread I don't think that this is true. Having been to several comps (not just MJ) I thought that last year's Ceroc champs was the poorest (worst seems a little too harsh, but that's the context in which I use "poorest") comp I have been to. Personal opinion.

J

[Sheepman]

Jayne I think your argument is spot on again, and regarding the respect for customers, I find it barely credible that Ceroc chooses to hold the event in a venue that is not good for dancing, surely that's what most of us are there for? Regardless of the other problems at Hammersmith, based on last May the dancefloor is in a dire state, even when there is enough space on it during the competitions. Since the closing of the Central club many years ago, many of the central London venues that Ceroc used have poor dancefloors, eg Jongleurs (Clapham), Baden Powell House, The Grand, and this is a major factor in my trips to local Ceroc venues now being very rare.


Originally posted by Sheena
I don't really see that peer pressure has much to do with it - surely the decision to attend or not is down to the individual, decided by many factors.........can I afford to go? do I want to go?being two of them.
If you hate the venue that much, then you don't go - simple.

I'm sure there are a lot of people who don't make it to Blackpool, from further South, because it's more expensive for them to go to than a competition held closer to home.

Sheena, maybe your resolve is better than mine, luckily I don't worry much about the "can I afford to go?" question (though "is it good value?" may figure.) As of about October last year, no way was I going to Blackpool this March, suffering injuries and competition fatigue, then the peer pressure starts - favourite dancers and friends going, meeting up with people from all over, maybe I could compete despite the injuries, etc. etc.

So I'll see you at Blackpool, and the pressure re. Hammersmith is already starting . . . I still say I'm not going, I've already got something else on, but then, it is only a short cycle ride up the road . . .

Greg

[Jayne]

Originally posted by Sheena
I'm sure there are a lot of people who don't make it to Blackpool, from further South, because it's more expensive for them to go to than a competition held closer to home.
I don't think that distance has much of a bearing on cost of attending. Yes, transport is one of the major costs of a competition but the difference in cost between driving to Blackpool from Scotland vs flying to London/Bristol is minimal in my experience. It's more a question of (perceived) effort involved.

Surely the major single expense when actually attending a comp is accomodation and even with the scottish comp or weekends like the forthcoming BB weekend most people will have to pay for accommodation. Your point is only really vaid if you're specifically talking about people in London not going to Blackpool because they have to pay accommodation whereas they'll go to the London comp because it's "just" as case of getting across London. (But that's a whole new soap box for me to jump on...). Or have I misundertood?

J :nice:

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Stuart M
Here's a thought - apologies if it's already been raised. At the UK Champs at Hammersmith last year, bags were searched to prevent drink and food being brought into the venue (presumably the Palais' policy, not Ceroc's). Were cigarettes confiscated too? I distinctly remember there being a cigarette machine inside the venue, so surely the same principle applies. Double standards...?
Thanks Stuart, you've reminded me of another reason not to go, I didn't find the smoke a major problem last year, but at times it was distinctly unpleasant.

Greg

[DavidB]

Originally posted by Jayne
Ispecifically talking about people in London not going to Blackpool because they have to pay accommodation whereas they'll go to the London comp because it's "just" as case of getting across London. I'm going to Blackpool, because it is worth driving 250 miles for.

I'm not going to Hammersmith, because it is not worth driving 5 miles for.

David

[Bill]

Originally posted by Gus
[ODA Mode On}
Good competitors ... but the same level (if not better) of competition can be seen at Blackpool, BritRoc etc with more room to dance, better facilties and less partisan judges (:devil: ).



For once Gus I have to disagree with the decision of the judges ( well at least in one category !! :wink: :D ). :whistle:

[Mary]

Originally posted by Bill
For once Gus I have to disagree with the decision of the judges ( well at least in one category !! :wink: :D ). :whistle:

Is that why Hammersmith is becoming too expensive for you?:devil: :devil:

:wink:

M

[Bill]

Originally posted by Mary
Is that why Hammersmith is becoming too expensive for you?:devil: :devil:

:wink:

M

well it helped cover some of the costs :whistle: :na:

[Gus]

Originally posted by Bill
For once Gus I have to disagree with the decision of the judges ( well at least in one category !! :wink: :D ). :whistle:
Proves my point exactly ... bl**dy Scots win everything at Hammersmith:wink:

[Yogi_Bear]

So it is to be Hammersmith Palais on 2 May this year....I don't expect to be going, assuming that
(a) there is a ridiculous policy of allowing huge queues to form outside
(b) there is a riduculous attempt to prevent people taking whatever they want into the venue
(c) there is a heavy handed attempt to make people leave their bags in cloakrooms
(d) there is the remotest prospect of smokong being allowed in the venue.

Forget, it, there are better events to go to, even if I don't go to Jumpin at thew Woodside this year :cheers:

At least we have been promised a much better venue next year...

[RobC]

Originally posted by Debster
The ballroom comp venues listed are way too expensive - and I'm sure NOT an option. Grosvenor House?? Hooley dooley man!

You apparently don't realise how expensive ballroom is in comparison to Ceroc. It's a universe of expense out of our league... and AMEN - Thank heavens for that too! Let's keep it that way.
I'm sorry but I have to disagree. I have been involved in Ballroom a lot longer than I have MJ, and while it is possible to spend BIG BUCKS on ball gowns, tail suits etc, the cost of the competitions (venue hire, PA hire, pay professional judges etc) is not necessarily any more expensive than putting on a MJ competition.

In fact, if students can manage to run competitions with entry fees sub-£15 and manage to cover the costs, why are we even having this conversation ? :confused:

Granted it was 10 years ago and prices are likely to have gone up in that time, but if the Inter-Varsity Dance Association (a non-profit making student organisation) can manage to put on the national Student Ballroom championships at the Grosvenor, with the entry price being acceptable to a poor student's wallet, why can't Ceroc get it's head out of it's ar$e and put its customers first. :angry:

[Bill]

Originally posted by Gus
Proves my point exactly ... bl**dy Scots win everything at Hammersmith:wink:

It was a good year for the Scots last year :wink: :D Hope they all do as well this year. Still haven't decided if we're going down.

[Lounge Lizard]

Why does the venue have to be IN London
the main access to London [other than trains] is via heathrow & M25 so why not re-locate in (say) Windsor area, surley there must be a suitable venue on the outskirts of London

[Peter]

Is anyone still interested in going?

The website is now working, including ticket booking & payment. Ceroc champs (http://www.cerocchamps.com) You only need to be over 45 to enter the "old gits" category Old gits (http://www.cerocchamps.com/categories.htm#oldgits)

[Gus]

Originally posted by Peter
Is anyone still interested in going?
You only need to be over 45 to enter the "old gits" category
I think that speaks volumes about Ceoc's attitude towards the majority of its dancers ... they still dont get it ... that the vast majority of their dancers are not in this mythical 20 -30 age group:sick:

[Debster]

Originally posted by RobC
I'm sorry but I have to disagree. I have been involved in Ballroom a lot longer than I have MJ, and while it is possible to spend BIG BUCKS on ball gowns, tail suits etc, the cost of the competitions (venue hire, PA hire, pay professional judges etc) is not necessarily any more expensive than putting on a MJ competition.

In fact, if students can manage to run competitions with entry fees sub-£15 and manage to cover the costs, why are we even having this conversation ? :confused:
...

The only intervarsity comps I've seen were in Uni halls etc, not in London, and the audience was way smaller than for Hammersmith. Indeed most regular ballroom comps have a very small audience. (And some a rather small particpation because there are so many more). I haven't been introduced to the Grosvenor House gig so can't comment.

I'm not a student. I can't afford the regular ballroom circuit. Admittedly my personal experience is the only basis I can use to make a comparison. There are many cheaper comps to go to, but they are not on the scale of the London champs. And the Elsa Wells International Ballroom held in London is MUCH more pricey (and fair enough too). Besides, try booking the Albert Hall with just six months notice...

I want the Champs to be in London! (There, somebody had to say it...)

[Pammy]

Originally posted by Gus
I think that speaks volumes about Ceoc's attitude towards the majority of its dancers ... they still dont get it ... that the vast majority of their dancers are not in this mythical 20 -30 age group:sick:

Totally agree - 45 is DEFINITELY NOT, old gits! :mad:

[Martin]

Well I might go, but only because I might be in London then...

Having said that, I would not travel to it.

IMHO - a panel of all Ceroc teachers do not favour "others"
Scary thought - some Ceroc teachers have been dancing less than 2 years (Beautiful, thin and acceptable people though)

Got put off last year when I did make the effort - they did pick out who could and who could not do the showcases (I got binned and so did Clinton [multiple winner of showcases here]) wonder what the TRUE criteria was.
I also did the teams last year and came second to the "Ceroc teachers crew" - watch the vid and let me know your comments...

[Debster]

Originally posted by Gus
I think that speaks volumes about Ceoc's attitude towards the majority of its dancers ... they still dont get it ... that the vast majority of their dancers are not in this mythical 20 -30 age group:sick:
Seniors in ballroom is 35 and over... I think Ceroc have aimed it about right to get a reasonable number of entrants for such a section - its not a personal comment on how close to the grave they think you are!:wink:

[Debster]

Originally posted by Martin
Got put off last year when I did make the effort - they did pick out who could and who could not do the showcases (I got binned and so did Clinton [multiple winner of showcases here]) wonder what the TRUE criteria was.

Well possibly first six entries in, qualified with the proof they were able to put on a show.
Possibly influenced by wanting to keep a percentage of local performers who would be able to conitnue to increase local venue revenue by being encouraged, seen and recognised. (2 out of 6 couples were from OS anyway)

But I'm only slightly offended that you suggest that we weren't good enough to be there... :(

[Martin]

Originally posted by Debster
Well possibly first six entries in, qualified with the proof they were able to put on a show.
Possibly influenced by wanting to keep a percentage of local performers who would be able to conitnue to increase local venue revenue by being encouraged, seen and recognised. (2 out of 6 couples were from OS anyway)

But I'm only slightly offended that you suggest that we weren't good enough to be there... :(

First 6 entries - not sure, I applied very early on, when there were still places. Did not have a great vid but was still corriing. Vid was required early on. Unless you are going to perform an "old" routine, it would not be ready then.
So gave a past routine.

% local performers might be the go, after all it is embarising when the Aussie's take out most.

3 out of 6 were aussie if you include Clayton and Janine (Aussie born and bred)
5 couples from Aussie might have been to much - Must make it clear it is a "National Ceroc people " comp, not a truely international open.

Local venue revenue - yeh I can see that...

Sorry did not catch your routine Debster - no reflection on your caberet.

[David Franklin]

Originally posted by Debster
Well possibly first six entries in, qualified with the proof they were able to put on a show.
Possibly influenced by wanting to keep a percentage of local performers who would be able to conitnue to increase local venue revenue by being encouraged, seen and recognised. (2 out of 6 couples were from OS anyway)Er, depending on how you categorise yourself and Hillel, and C&J, wasn't it 4 Australasian couples out of 7? Even if it was the correct result "on merit", I think there would be have been a lot of comments if there had been 6 non-UK pairs out of 7. I'm sure a lot of UK couples wouldn't bother entering again if that was how it turned out.


Originally posted by Martin
Must make it clear it is a "National Ceroc people " comp, not a truely international openOK, it's politics on one level, but it's actually fairly common in sport - look at the Olympics where most sports have a quota limiting entrants from 1 country. Kenya would probably have about 10 people in the steeplechase final without that rule. Or were the Sydney Olympics not "truely international"?

Did not have a great vid but was still corriing. Vid was required early on. Unless you are going to perform an "old" routine, it would not be ready then.On a practical note, the London champs had a couple of years of getting hit by people pulling out at the last moment. So given that the pressure for places last year was extremely tight, anything that indicated a lack of preparation was probably going to get looked at very harshly. The more "serious" competitors over here have generally used Blackpool as a trial run for the Ceroc champs, so would all have a finished routine quite early on.

Dave

[Bill]

Originally posted by Pammy
Totally agree - 45 is DEFINITELY NOT, old gits! :mad:

Think my students have been calling me that for years already :rolleyes: :D

Looks as if the title has come from the sponsors.... - if free wine then might be worth entering...............who do I know is over 45 ?? :na: :)

[Martin]

Originally posted by David Franklin
[B The more "serious" competitors over here have generally used Blackpool as a trial run for the Ceroc champs, so would all have a finished routine quite early on.

Dave [/B]


I am not sure that Blackpool is a lead up, most independants rate Blackpool as an unbiased forum.

Ceroc comps, a London champs, good to do, but lacks the superstar independants sometimes (from what I have been told)

If you want fresh new moves, exciting corrie and fresh routines PLEASE don't do that same old routine again.

Yes I could show you last years, BUT is that really what you want?

[Lounge Lizard]

Originally posted by David Franklin
The more "serious" competitors over here have generally used Blackpool as a trial run for the Ceroc champs, so would all have a finished routine quite early on.

Dave Sorry to infer Blackpool is a warm up for the ceroc champs is akin to the olympics being a warm up for the European games.
IMHO the Major competition in thr uk IS C2D UK OPEN

Ceroc comp is ok but the Blackpool event is the best.

Martin, our Latin Lover routine was turned down by ceroc so know how you feel

Peter

[David Franklin]

Originally posted by Martin
I am not sure that Blackpool is a lead up, most independants rate Blackpool as an unbiased forum.Wasn't supposed to be any kind of slur on Blackpool - just consequences of where events are in the calender (and history meaning people have tried to be "peak" for the Ceroc champs, even though I would say Blackpool is now the top showcase competition). There's not really time to do a new routine inbetween Blackpool and the Ceroc Champs for most people.

Proof of the pudding - every UK based couple (inc C&J, D&H) performed the same routine at Blackpool as at Ceroc. [And in nearly every case Blackpool was their routine "debut"]


Ceroc comps, a London champs, good to do, but lacks the superstar independants sometimes (from what I have been told)It's not at all clear what Ceroc expects in the showcase department. In previous years the requirements have been quite strict about "Ceroc content", which has excluded the likes of David/Lily or Robert/Deborah. Now they say any style of dance is acceptable, but notice they list lots of possible styles excluding modern jive. Speaking to the organizers, we got the strong impression a modern jive routine would not be looked at favourably. And then every accepted routine was very much "pure" modern jive!



If you want fresh new moves, exciting corrie and fresh routines PLEASE don't do that same old routine again.

Yes I could show you last years, BUT is that really what you want? At the end of the day, it's their competition, and they can decide on the rules. In both 2001 and 2002 they ended up short of contestants because of people pulling out very late in the day as they weren't ready. So now they want to make sure everyone they choose is essentially "ready to compete" at the time they are selected. If you'd said "we're working on a new routine, but this is our old one, and I guarantee you we will be ready to perform the old one if the new one doesn't work out", it might have helped your case. But then, I guess you wouldn't want to do a year old routine anyhow...

[Martin]

Originally posted by Lounge Lizard

Martin, our Latin Lover routine was turned down by ceroc so know how you feel

Peter

Makes me feel much better - also so sad - politics and all that.

Give me an "open" champs anytime.

[Bill]

Originally posted by David Franklin
I would say Blackpool is now the top showcase competition).


Blackpool is certainly the much better of the two events but my only complaint would be that in Blackpool there were too many showcases and too little freestyle time. So it's understandable that at some point there has to be a limit on number of entries.

Missed quite a few last year as it was the only time to go and eat

[Martin]

Originally posted by David Franklin
If you'd said "we're working on a new routine, but this is our old one, and I guarantee you we will be ready to perform the old one if the new one doesn't work out", it might have helped your case. But then, I guess you wouldn't want to do a year old routine anyhow...

No, would never do an old one for a showcase ( but did for teams:D )

We did an average IMHO, teams routine (Aussie speak) in the UK as could not get the "A" team over. Still IMHO we did well. ( watch the vid and comment)

Less Catholics in Aussie, so have not been advised to pull out at the last minute :cheers:

[David Franklin]

Originally posted by Lounge Lizard
Sorry to infer Blackpool is a warm up for the ceroc champs is akin to the olympics being a warm up for the European games.Actually, this does happen - really! Particularly in cases where someone knows they won't really be "ready" for the Olympics but will hopefully be ready for the Europeans. You'll hear younger athletes saying this kind of thing all the time. [Usually couched in terms of "this will be good experience..."]


IMHO the Major competition in thr uk IS C2D UK OPEN

Ceroc comp is ok but the Blackpool event is the best.
In general I'd agree - the only caveat being the Australasian contingent at the Ceroc champs did make a significant impact IMHO.


Martin, our Latin Lover routine was turned down by ceroc so know how you feelWe were turned down as well - but we ended up having to be in Wales on the day of the competition anyhow, so every cloud has a silver lining!

[Martin]

Originally posted by David Franklin

In general I'd agree - the only caveat being the Australasian contingent at the Ceroc champs did make a significant impact IMHO.

[/B]

Mainly due to Camber and Ceroc comp being close to the week-end :D
My focus was Camber (London Ceroc a bonus)
See you all April this year:waycool:

Marty

[Gus]

Originally posted by David Franklin
The more "serious" competitors over here have generally used Blackpool as a trial run for the Ceroc champs
Dave

Sorry (well not really) ... the following is a strictly NON-ODA comment

What a load of co**lers!

The "serious" competitors go to the UK Champs at Blackpool. Some of them may also go to the Ceroc champs! BIG difference ... if you want to get into the real world and ascertain who the common populance think is a more importnt championship .... ask around.

If I'm overreacting please let me know (won't you Will:wink: ) but I still feel that there is an undeserved smugness about the Ceroc champs. I just can't figure those who assume that its the premier competiton.

[David Franklin]

Originally posted by Gus
Sorry (well not really) ... the following is a strictly NON-ODA comment

What a load of co**lers!

The "serious" competitors go to the UK Champs at Blackpool. Some of them may also go to the Ceroc champs! BIG difference ... if you want to get into the real world and ascertain who the common populance think is a more importnt championship .... ask around.To be honest, I do think you're overreacting. But it seems several other people have misinterpreted what I wrote, so I guess I'm at fault.

"Warm-up" was probably a bad choice of words. For a variety of factors; history, the fact that there's no restriction on entries at Blackpool, the various calender dates - people are much likelier to perform a "new" routine at Blackpool than at Ceroc. They're also much more likely to perform a routine that's "not quite ready" at Blackpool. And so, many people will say things like "I'm hoping to do Blackpool, but it won't be really polished until the Ceroc champs" (and I'm talking about people who have placed and won here). Very very few people create a new routine between Blackpool and the Ceroc champs. In that sense Blackpool is still a "warm up" - even though it is now the premier event as well.

Again, you see this in other areas. Can't remember exactly when it was, but there were two big athletics champs were only a few weeks apart (Europeans and Commonwealth, perhaps). The first was "the big one", but people found they weren't as ready as they'd hoped, and readily said the first would be good preparation for the second.

As for which in the "real world" is more important - I would have thought by numbers more people know about the Ceroc champs than the C2D ones. OK, I'm in London and I'd expect a bit of bias, but a lot of Cerocers I know haven't even heard of the C2D competition. I'd agree that C2D is probably more prestigious amongst the competitors, and it's certainly the competition I'd rather win. But the average punter? Not so sure.

To put it another way before you jump down my throat. C2D certainly deserves to be the premier competition. In my view it's better in pretty much every respect than the Ceroc competition. But I'm not sure it has won the battle for "hearts and minds" amongst the average jiver yet. Winning mindshare does take time and publicity, and Ceroc isn't keen on providing publicity to its competitors.


If I'm overreacting please let me know (won't you Will:wink: ) but I still feel that there is an undeserved smugness about the Ceroc champs. I just can't figure those who assume that its the premier competiton. My previous post obviously was desparately unclear if you think I have any degree of smugness about the Ceroc champs! Frankly, I think the Ceroc champs are a bit of a mess, and rapidly losing a lot of credibility. I'm not impressed by the venue, the way competitors and spectators are treated, or the judging. [I will say they are excellent at scheduling though].

Dave

[Bill]

Originally posted by David Franklin
As for which in the "real world" is more important - I would have thought by numbers more people know about the Ceroc champs than the C2D ones. OK, I'm in London and I'd expect a bit of bias, but a lot of Cerocers I know haven't even heard of the C2D competition. I'd agree that C2D is probably more prestigious amongst the competitors, and it's certainly the competition I'd rather win. But the average punter? Not so sure.


Dave

I think in Scotland Blackpool has become the more prestigious and the better known for a variety of reasons. Even though those of us who go are all 'cerocers' many more make the trip to Blackpool than to London - even though it can be quicker and cheaper to fly to London.

The reaction from Blackpool over the last two years has been fantastic and the fact that Keith and Janey came to the Scottish Comp probably helped as well.

The fact that the Scots did pretty well at Blackpool and were able to be together and create an atmposhere - and actually see the whole event :rolleyes: :na: ...helped as well.

Up here there may be a few dancers and a possibly even a couple of the team cabarets that see the Scottish comp as the 'warm up' for Blackpool and won't be going to London. I know the venue is still a major issue with a lot of dancers up here so only a few will probably make the trip south in May.

[Dan Hudson]

I would like to come out in defence of Ceroc HQ on this.

Ceroc HQ have spent a lot of time looking at other venues in london that would be more suitable for the Champs, hence the reason for the late confirmation of the date.

Most of the venues were fully booked for this entire year and most of next. Some of the venues would not commit to a date unitl nearer the time. As you can appreciate this would leave Ceroc little or no time ot advertise and promote the event and indeed leave little or on time to prepare and make the event as good as the client base insists/expects.

As I said in my previous post, the cost implications on some London venues are astronomical and most just offer a bare basic room and everything else is an extra.

I am off to Blackpool this year and will be able to give a more balanced verdict on which event is 'best'

I do agree that last years champs was not brilliant and HQ are aware of that and i am sure this year you will se a marked imrovement. (apart from the same venue)

The new Ceroc Management have implemented some fantastic changes in the short time they have been in control and the champs will be improved, its just that these things don't happen overnight. I do not know for a fact but would imagine there are talks for venues for next years going on already.

So please make the effort to come to London for the champs, if only to dance with me!! Especially you Bill!!

take care

Dan

[David Franklin]

Originally posted by Bill
I think in Scotland Blackpool has become the more prestigious and the better known for a variety of reasons. Even though those of us who go are all 'cerocers' many more make the trip to Blackpool than to London - even though it can be quicker and cheaper to fly to London.I'm kind of surprised that the Ceroc champs aren't still better known, even if people don't actually go. But maybe you don't get the saturation advertising that goes on down here. Back when I still went to Ceroc in London, the teachers would give a plug for the champs at literally every lesson for about the preceeding 2 months. However much you had reservations about the venue, you'd get worn down - it was like the Borg - "resistance is futile..."


The fact that the Scots did pretty well at Blackpool and were able to be together and create an atmposhere - and actually see the whole event :rolleyes: :na: ...helped as well. See the competitors? What a revolutionary notion! Wouldn't you rather be packed in like sardines in a dark and smelly cave, and have to bob up and down hoping to see a glimpse of someones head? I'm not sure people like you should be allowed into a Ceroc venue with ideas like that!


Up here there may be a few dancers and a possibly even a couple of the team cabarets that see the Scottish comp as the 'warm up' for Blackpool and won't be going to London. I know the venue is still a major issue with a lot of dancers up here so only a few will probably make the trip south in May. I can't say I blame you (about making the trip). I suspect fewer and fewer people will travel to the Ceroc champs - there are probably enough people relatively local who will keep going, but if you need to pay for travel/accommodation I can certainly think of better ways of spending a couple of hundred quid!

Dave

[Bill]

Originally posted by David Franklin
I'm kind of surprised that the Ceroc champs aren't still better known, even if people don't actually go. But maybe you don't get the saturation advertising that goes on down here. Dave

It is mentioned by the teachers but few dancers check the national website up here and most will get the info either if they are regulars on the forum or if they actually listen to the announcements at the end of the class.

Blackpool is mentioned of course during classes but details pass by word of mouth and far fewer folk, certainly in Aberdeen, have been to London than been to Blackpool. And it is the venue because we have to drive or get the train to Blackpool which can take 4 -5 hours from Aberdeen whereas we can fly to London in 1 hour ( but whole journey nearer 3 I suppose) and costs would actually be about the same.

[David Franklin]

Originally posted by Bill
Blackpool is mentioned of course during classes but details pass by word of mouth and far fewer folk, certainly in Aberdeen, have been to London than been to Blackpool. And it is the venue because we have to drive or get the train to Blackpool which can take 4 -5 hours from Aberdeen whereas we can fly to London in 1 hour ( but whole journey nearer 3 I suppose) and costs would actually be about the same. Yeah, the big division in costs is whether you can reasonably drive home after the event. As DavidB says, Blackpool is worth spending the money, Hammersmith isn't :devil:

My point was that I think CerocHQ tend to look at it as "it's not bad value for 25 quid?", and don't recognize how different the cost equation is for people out of London. Until I went to Blackpool, I really hadn't appreciated how much the "other costs" mount up when you're travelling to a venue, so I suspect London based organizers don't always do so either.

Dave

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Dan Hudson
Ceroc HQ have spent a lot of time looking at other venues in london that would be more suitable for the Champs, I'm sure they have, but we're still stuck on that London thing, as Davidb says, it's not worth the 5 mile journey (3 miles for me). Blackpool is well worth the extra cost as a competitor (though as Mrs Sheepman won't be there this year, maybe it's too much for spectators?)

LL suggested Windsor, I've never been, but I've heard that the Ceroc venue there is huge. Also surely almost any of the big London town halls would do the job better? eg Walthamstow, Hammersmith, Wandsworth, (but I suspect they'd be more expensive, and you wouldn't get so many spectators in - £££ :wink: )

Greg

[Debster]

Originally posted by Martin
Unless you are going to perform an "old" routine, it would not be ready then.

Not necessarily. We specifically chose to compete at the champs in May and started working on our routine in Nov/Dec so we did have it reasonably arranged by the time the video was required. We were planning to continue to practise and polish for that last part up to May. To try it out at Blackpool was an after thought.

I agree with David, the main problem Ceroc had was trying to avoid people pulling out at the last minute because they weren't ready.

Sorry did not catch your routine Debster - no reflection on your caberet.
Oh OK. Thanks. I won't be offended then :)

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Sheepman
I said right after the last one that I wouldn't go to Hammersmith again, so I'm with you on that one.

Trouble is, if it's on 2nd May, I'm already booked that evening, I suppose I could just make the reasonable assumption that I wouldn't make it to the finals anyway, so won't need to stay after 7pm! It's happened, after 51 weeks of saying I wouldn't go back to that place, I've finally caved in, and I will be competing at this year's championships.
So there are 2 ways you can see this turnaround:-

1). I'm a spineless, weasel minded toe rag, whose word is less reliable than a plumbers estimate!

2). I'm the errant knight, destined to help out a fair maiden!

I prefer to believe in destiny! Look forward to seeing you all there. (Apart, that is, from those who have more resolve than me!)

Greg

[RobC]

Originally posted by Sheepman
It's happened, after 51 weeks of saying I wouldn't go back to that place, I've finally caved in, and I will be competing at this year's championships.
So there are 2 ways you can see this turnaround:-

1). I'm a spineless, weasel minded toe rag, whose word is less reliable than a plumbers estimate!

Well I'm still firm in my resolve - you won't see me back at the Ceroc Champs until they move venue. :whistle:

[stewart38]

IT always amazes me how so many cerocers expect something for nothing

Windsor is just a large sports hall and Hammersmith Town hall is used but wouldn't for champs

People moan if they have to spend £10 for a saturday night out and demand 'free water'

My company pay £250 a head for a large do would cerocers pay that ?Then we can go to the Albert Hall

If people dont want to go on sunday thats good as its more room for me !

Last yr champs were great it was crowded but so many events are.

I assume the queueing and other 'things' will be resolved this yr

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by RobC
you won't see me back at the Ceroc Champs until they move venue. Couldn't you even be persuaded by a gorgeous lady who's a fab dancer, or even a man in a pink tutu? :wink:
Greg

[RobC]

Originally posted by Sheepman
Couldn't you even be persuaded by a gorgeous lady who's a fab dancer, or even a man in a pink tutu? :wink:
Greg
After our success at Blackpool last year, Andy finally wore me down and I agreed to go back to the Palais after several years of giving it a miss - and it only served as a bitter reminder of why I don't go there anymore. I won't make that mistake again !!

I would quite happily enter any other competition with a gorgeous lady (or even Andy) - Bristol and BritRoc aren't that far off....... any offers ?

[Jayne]

I'm going to jump on the bandwagon here too...


Originally posted by stewart38
Windsor is just a large sports hall and Hammersmith Town hall is used but wouldn't for champs
Not sure what your point is here (i fear it would become clearer with punctuation though).


People moan if they have to spend £10 for a saturday night out and demand 'free water'
It's not a demand - it's required by law AFAIK.


My company pay £250 a head for a large do would cerocers pay that ?Then we can go to the Albert Hall
yes. Blackpool cost in excess of £300 for me.


Last yr champs were great it was crowded but so many events are.
I think there are few people who thought that Blackpool was overcrowded. Besides which, organisers can determine the maximum number of people allowed at an event. Just because other events are overcrowded doesn't mean that *all* organisers have to treat their customers with the same contempt.


I assume the queueing and other 'things' will be resolved this yr [/B]
That's what we're all hoping! Many people have decided to give the ceroc champs one last chance this year (myself included).

J

[ericklondon]

I assume the queueing and other 'things' will be resolved this yr [/B]

We are trying as best as we can to sort out all the minor problems we had last year.
As regards to the queueing at the door, the event will open its doors at 10am, EVERYONE will have to be searched this is due to the guidelines issued by the police and the home office following terrorist threats that the CLUB has to implement. All London venues holding public events have to follow those guidelines REGARDLESS of the event.
There's nothing we can do about it.
See latest news on www.cerochamps.com

Jayne,
as regards to free water.... I revert you to my previous comments about water in a very old thread.
Free running water has to be made available free BUT not bottled water this is up to the club owners what they do and profit margins are huge on bottled water.

The law definition on supplying water in clubs is quite specific and a CLEAR difference is made betwen running water - ie: out of a tap - which should be provided free of charge and bottled water - ie from a natural source, unless it's that bloody rubbish from Coca Cola !!:grin:.

As you can imagine, we all working very hard on this Champs to make sure that everyone has a fantastic day out... BUT there's always a minority who will find something to moan about !!

See you all on Sunday

Erick
:waycool:

[Peter]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by bradders
The floor is scrubbed and washed after the School Disco.
(Lots of drunk people partially dress in school uniforms, apparently it is a real meat market... but I have never been!!!) The cleaners come in at about 3.30am. I will request that the floor gets buffed. I am sure they have the appropriate equipment.
(Also have to ensure it does not end up like an ice rink after buffing).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Erick - can you reassure us that the dance floor WILL be buffed and in good condition?

[ericklondon]

Peter,

At our last meeting at the Palais, Dave also had a meeting with the cleaning contrators and explained to them how important it was for the floor to be in perfect condition.
I trust this will be sorted.

I do understand your concerns and there is nothing worse than dancing on a floor that feels like an ice rink.. Ceroc or not....

I am going there this afternoon and will check it out.
Hope this helps

See you on Sunday

Erick :waycool:

[Dave Hancock]

Erick,

My concern of the floor and I think that which many others have is not that it will be like an ice rink, to be honest I'd be amazed if it was even semi-quick, but that it will be really slow, due to booze etc, being spilled on it on the Saturday night and thus the need for it cleaned and buffed to speed it up.

[ericklondon]

Dave,

I certainly understand your concerns and I have just spoken to Dave who assured me that he has spoken to the cleaning contractors and REQUESTED that the floor is cleaned and buffed up so that it meets our standards.

In previous years.... they just walked around the floor with a nasty looking mop !!!

Hope this helps.

See you on Sunday

Erick :waycool:

[Peter]

Doors open at 10.30am. LUCKY DIP COMPETITORS - You need to be on the dance floor by 1100hr (11.00am) for partnering up. First heat starts at 1130hr 11.30am) - PLEASE DON'T BE LATE

If all 120 couples in the Lucky Dip are to be searched in 30 mins, thats one couple every 15 seconds ... unless there is a different system to last year (eg a fast track for Lucky Dip couples) there is no chance that this will start on time ....

Erick ... any reassurances on this point?

[ericklondon]

Peter,

How very strange that you are raising pretty much the same points Dave and I were discussing about an hour ago.
Let me call Dave again....

We will be opening the doors at 1030am as planned but all the Lucky Dip competitors will be drawn out of the queue from 10am.

Are you entering the Lucky Dip Peter ?

Erick




:waycool:

[Peter]

Originally posted by ericklondon
Are you entering the Lucky Dip Peter?

Yes, I am competitor number 1 ..

[ericklondon]

Excellent !!

Good Luck and see you on Sunday !!

Erick:waycool:

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Dave Hancock
My concern of the floor and I think that which many others have is not that it will be like an ice rink, to be honest I'd be amazed if it was even semi-quick, but that it will be really slow, due to booze etc, being spilled on it on the Saturday night and thus the need for it cleaned and buffed to speed it up. :yeah:
Last year it was very patchy, (mostly sticky) - I would have preferred an ice rink!

Greg

[Peter]

Am I doing something very wrong?

When I go to the www.cerocchamps.com website and click on the tab on the left side of the screen for "judges", it takes me to a blank page here (www.cerocchamps.com/judges2.htm). I discovered by accident that the information is hidden on the website here (www.cerocchamps.com/judges.php)

Now I am trying to find the events schedule. I have now learnt that there is no point in clicking on the tab champs/events schedule because that takes me to here (www.cerocchamps.com/schedule.htm) - that page only informs me that "the event schedule for the 2004 Champs will be posted onto the website in
early April 2004." Maybe that is a misprint ... should it say early April 2005?

Can anyone help? Erick??

[Jayne]

Originally posted by Peter
Am I doing something very wrong?


The schedule is here (http://www.cerocchamps.com/schedule.htm)

The judges are here (http://www.cerocchamps.com/judges.php)

J :nice:

[ericklondon]

Peter,

I have just checked the website and it's all working perfectly well this side of the Thames...
All the information you require is on there.

Erick

[ericklondon]

Anything else I can help anyone with before I get in the bath ???

Erick
:waycool:

[Peter]

This is completelt bizarre ... when I click on Jayne's link I get this ..

"Event Schedule for Ceroc

Championships 2004

The event schedule for the 2004 Champs will be posted onto the website in early April 2004.

The schedule shows at what time each category heat will be taking place.

The Ceroc Champs has a reputation for running on time so it is important that you are fully aware of the timings of your heat and any subsequent rounds that you may be successful in being chosen for.

You can find out if you have been successful in progressing to the next round in you category by visiting the Heats desk which is to be situated on the fisrt floor balcony opposite the bar.

IF YOU MISS YOUR SLOT YOU WILL BE DISQUALIFIED."

[Emma]

Originally posted by ericklondon
Anything else I can help anyone with before I get in the bath ??? I've got some shopping needs doing, a couple of application forms to fill in and the kitchen could do with a clean......:grin:

[ericklondon]

Emma....

And may be, you'd like me to help you look for your headphones..... ???:rofl: :rofl:


Peter... very bizzare, you must be logging onto a parallel world...
If you want the schedule I can email it to you.

Erick

:waycool:

[Emma]

Originally posted by Peter
This is completelt bizarre ... when I click on Jayne's link I get this .. It works perfectly for me..but here it is again unlinkerated just in case ;) http://www.cerocchamps.com/schedule.htm :nice:

[Peter]

Originally posted by ericklondon
you must be logging onto a parallel world... If you want the schedule I can email it to you.:waycool:

Heeeellllllllooooooo ... am I here on my own? Maybe the only way I can keep in touch is by email ..... Yes please, send it over!

[ericklondon]

Yeah it works and that's THAT !!

My god....... !!!!!!

Subject closed.

Erick


:angry: :waycool:

Ps: Can I get in the bath now ????

[Emma]

Originally posted by ericklondon
And may be, you'd like me to help you look for your headphones..... ??? No darling, I know *exactly* where my headphones are!

[Peter]

Originally posted by Emma
It works perfectly for me..but here it is again unlinkerated just in case ;) http://www.cerocchamps.com/schedule.htm :nice:

Thanks Emma .. but its still the same 4 me .... this is more and more bizarre ... I wonder how many other competitors are in here with me, completely unable to see the events schedule ...

[ericklondon]

Emma....
Yeah I know you know.... but last night you didn't know where they were did you ???
:rofl: :rofl:

Peter,
You on Broadband or dial up ?
Just keep trying there's obviously a problem your end.

The schedule is for info only, all competitors will be given a copy on arrival at the venue, AFTER being searched.

Erick
:waycool:

[Peter]

Originally posted by ericklondon
Peter,
You on Broadband or dial up? Just keep trying there's obviously a problem your end. The schedule is for info only, all competitors will be given a copy on arrival at the venue, AFTER being searched.

Erick
:waycool:

AOL Broadband rapide ... I plan to join the queue around 10am so I can expect the schedule, after searching, at around ... 2.30pm ....

[ericklondon]

I won't even bother to reply.

Erick
:grin:

[Emma]

Originally posted by ericklondon
Emma....
Yeah I know you know.... but last night you didn't know where they were did you ???
Oh yeah, I knew exactly where they were...it's just that I was somewhere else!!! :rofl:

[Peter]

Originally posted by Peter
AOL Broadband rapide

Looks like an AOL problem .. if I instead access the same webpage via the "not embedded" Internet Explorer, I can see the schedule ...

So I can see two completely different versions of the page, depending on how I choose to look at it! Even more bizarre

[ericklondon]

well there you go...
That should keep you occupied for a while :rofl: :rofl:

Just got your email back... no problem:grin:

Erick

[RobC]

Originally posted by Peter
Looks like an AOL problem .. if I instead access the same webpage via the "not embedded" Internet Explorer, I can see the schedule ...

So I can see two completely different versions of the page, depending on how I choose to look at it! Even more bizarre

[Techy-speak]
Check that you are not caching an old copy of the page.
In IE, go to Tools -> Internet Options and in the Temporary Internet Files section on the General Tab, click on Delete Files.
[/Techy-speak]

[Bill]

Originally posted by ericklondon
well there you go...
That should keep you occupied for a while :rofl: :rofl:

Just got your email back... no problem:grin:

Erick

does this mean you're in the bath now.....................:rolleyes: watch out for that rubber duck :na:

[Gadget]

Originally posted by Peter
Looks like an AOL problem .. if I instead access the same webpage via the "not embedded" Internet Explorer, I can see the schedule ...

So I can see two completely different versions of the page, depending on how I choose to look at it! Even more bizarre
Not that bizarre: they copy a large chunk of the internet to their own servers so that their software can access it directly instead of reaching through many inter-connected servers of the web. In theory this should make it quicker for you to see web content. It also allows them to censor and rate the contents. In practice it means that less requested pages get checked less frequently to make sure they are up-to-date and you can't find pages you are looking for.

Better to go with a proper provider rather than a micky-mouse company (or should that be Wyle E. Coyote?)

[Graham W]

bRISTOL WISHES -

Good luck to Mark & Catherine ('Redhead'), Elaine (yep the forum one - I havent been banned from here yet!, E) & Simon A, myself & Lesley (Ill be of to pub afta 1st round probably as its the Open) & Lesley & Partner in Old "Faggots" category... & anyone else having a go!! ROCK N ROLL..

oh yeah - my tip for advanced - Phil W & Yuko..

G

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by Graham W


-snip-

..in Old "Faggots" category...



I'm so young looking I'm taking my passport so I can prove I qualify:devil:

I expect some other competitors should do the same...

[Minnie M]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
I'm so young looking I'm taking my passport so I can prove I qualify...

Know wot ya mean Andy - after nearly being disqualified at Blackpool, I am not entering the Old Gits at Ceroc - to save embarassment :wink: :rofl:

[ericklondon]

..in Old "Faggots" category...

How rude.... !!
I know a lot of people would take offence to this sort of language !!

It's the Old Gits Category !!

:grin:

Erick
:waycool:

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by ericklondon
How rude.... !!
I know a lot of people would take offence to this sort of language !!

It's the Old Gits Category !!

:grin:

Erick
:waycool:

Git /git/ n. Brit. sl. a silly or contemptible person.

Anyone like to claim I'm entering the wrong category?:devil:

Thought not:tears:

[Debster]

Originally posted by Graham W

oh yeah - my tip for advanced - Phil W & Yuko..

G Yep, got to agree with that, they are looking fantastic!

[Peter]

An email from Bradders

"Hi Peter,
I can assure you that I have spoken to the venue management and that I have spoken to the owner of the cleaning contractors that cleans the venue and will be calling them again tomorrow to remind them that they have assured me that the floor will be mechanically scrubbed nad them mechanically buffed following Saturday nights event abd ready for the Champs.
So fingers crossed all will be well.
Cheers
David"

[DavidB]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
...person...

Anyone like to claim I'm entering the wrong category? Do you have a medical certificate to prove that?

[ericklondon]

My Final words for today because Dave and I are VERY busy !!

GOOD LUCK TO EVERYONE WHO IS COMPETING ON SUNDAY !!

:cheers:


Erick :waycool:

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by DavidB
Do you have a medical certificate to prove that?

I have one to prove I'm silly...

But I don't think that's going to be disputed:tears:

[Mary]

Just got back from 2 weeks away working and NO DANCING!!!!!!! Just like to say good luck to everyone for Sunday and looking forward to seeing everyone there. Just got to remember how to do this dancing thingy.:what:

Erick, I thought you played some great stuff last year. Hope you've got some pretty cool stuff lined up for us this year.:clap:

M

[ericklondon]

Mary... !!! You GORGEOUS woman !!
Make sure you come and say hello !!

Erick xxx
:kiss:

[stewart38]

Originally posted by ericklondon
Peter,


We will be opening the doors at 1030am as planned but all the Lucky Dip competitors will be drawn out of the queue from 10am.


Erick

:waycool:


Ill save your time I'll just go to the front of the queue :waycool:

Lucky dip competitor

[stewart38]

Originally posted by Jayne

That's what we're all hoping! Many people have decided to give the ceroc champs one last chance this year (myself included).

J [/B]

What ever happen to just having fun :(

All this moaning ,thats what it about isnt it . fun ?



:tears:

[ericklondon]

Very well said Stewart and thank you very much for your/my thoughts !!

We are working extremely hard to make the Champs a very good event BUT there's always a minority who will find something to moan about !!

It's about having fun..... !!! So.... chill out a bit and keep dancing !!

Erick
:waycool:

[RobC]

Originally posted by Jayne

That's what we're all hoping! Many people have decided to give the ceroc champs one last chance this year (myself included).

Not me - they had their last chance last year.


Originally posted by stewart38
What ever happen to just having fun :(

All this moaning ,thats what it about isnt it . fun ?

Yes, but when you are prevented from enjoying the day by the quality of the venue, attitude of the venue staff / management ...... (please note, I am not having a dig at the competition organisers / DJs / Judges or anything else other than issues relating to the venue - you all do a fantastic job given the poor surrounding you have to work with.)

I'm all for having fun - I haven't entered a competition, taking it seriously and 'expecting to win' for some time. But, when you don't enjoy an event consistently, year after year, you have to ask yourself, why am I continuing to pay £25 a time to not have fun ?

Move the competition to another venue and I'll come back and give it another chance. In the mean time, my boycotte stands (even if others have proved too weak willed and relented).

[stewart38]

Originally posted by ericklondon
Very well said Stewart and thank you very much for your/my thoughts !!


Erick
:waycool:

Glad I phrased it correctly look forward to the 'free entry' next time.

:wink:

[Martin]

Originally posted by stewart38
Ill save your time I'll just go to the front of the queue :waycool:

Lucky dip competitor

Well confusing -

As the comp goes on into the evening it is obviously a long day.

Queing not a great idea, so intending to get there 11am when the doors are open and the que is being delt with - No point being there before the doors are open surely??? has the world gone mad?

So what is this 10am thing. Are you processing people while standing in the rain outside the venue - or was it a joke (I hope)

You can only hope to start the lucky dip once you have let the people in through the door!!!

:confused: :confused: Hoping to do lucky (or not so lucky if you get me!:blush: ) dip - now if only it was clear as to what is happening with the que stuff.

[There are often penalties associated with my que phobia...]

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by Martin
So what is this 10am thing. Are you processing people while standing in the rain outside the venue - or was it a joke (I hope)

You can only hope to start the lucky dip once you have let the people in through the door!!!

That's what you think.

We have to dance the first heat of Lucky Dip outside in the street. If we're good enough we're invited into the Palais to take part in round 2. If we're not good enough we join the back of the queue and are body cavity searched by gorillas wearing latex gloves before we're allowed into the building:wink:

I'm rather looking forward to the search process so I'll be dancing particularly badly in round 1 :devil:

[ericklondon]

Dear Everybody,

Doors will be opening at 1030 as planned as previously mentionned and if we have to start the competion late that is our problem and nothing for anyone else to worry about BUT us.

You do not really think that we would start the lucky dip without ALL the competitors who have registered...???



[There are often penalties associated with my que phobia...]

?????? you can't be going shopping very often then can you ??

Erick:waycool: :grin:

Ps: what rain...?? did it say it was going to rain? if it rains, my advice is.. bring an umbrella !!:grin:

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by RobC
(even if others have proved too weak willed and relented). Thanks for that little dig Rob! (Yeah I know there are others who were equally weak willed.) I'd just like to point out that you haven't even seen half of my temptation :wink: :drool: and this is only my second time, would my will be equally as weak for a third?

(Oh and did I mention the fact that she is a fab dancer.)

Greg

[Gus]

Originally posted by RobC
I'm all for having fun - I haven't entered a competition, taking it seriously and 'expecting to win' for some time. But, when you don't enjoy an event consistently, year after year, you have to ask yourself, why am I continuing to pay £25 a time to not have fun ?


Came to a similar conclusion ... thats why we're intending to run a 'fun' competition at our (Northwich) July freestyle. Free to enter, just bring a partner. will probably do two rounds of 'tap on the shoulder' then a final of the best 8. Hopefully will encourage more people to consider entering competitions ... but will only work if the cost of entering competitions comes down in price :sick:

[Boomer]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
... If we're not good enough we join the back of the queue and are body cavity searched by gorillas wearing latex gloves before we're allowed into the building:wink:
...
Oh no you're not! I won't do it I tell you ! :tears:

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by Boomer
Oh no you're not! I won't do it I tell you ! :tears:

Come on, there's a nice Boomster. They're nice, bannana scented latex gloves..

..and it's only a very small cavity:devil:

[Boomer]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
Come on, there's a nice Boomster. They're nice, bannana scented latex gloves..

..and it's only a very small cavity:devil:
..avity..avity...ity....ity.....ty........ty...... y......

[Barry Shnikov]

Originally posted by Peter
Looks like an AOL problem .. if I instead access the same webpage via the "not embedded" Internet Explorer, I can see the schedule ...

So I can see two completely different versions of the page, depending on how I choose to look at it! Even more bizarre

I do NOT know why people use AOL and other ISPs that eff about with the browser. I also don't know why AOL think it necessary to eff with the browser. My mum gets something similar occasionally with Tesco.net

...though I see someone else attributes the problems to AOL's proxy server technology. You should be able to switch that off, alternatively with some proxy servers you can press <F5> to refresh the page and it will pop off and retrieve a current copy.

Move on to a decent ISP like Pipex!

[Lory]

GOOD LUCK TO ALL FORUMITES! :clap: :cheers: :hug:

[Martin]

Thanks to ericklondon re-confirmation
:grin:

All good fun, looking forward to catching up with people and cheerng loudly. :clap: :clap:


Martin

[Minnie M]

Originally posted by Lory
GOOD LUCK TO ALL FORUMITES! :clap: :cheers: :hug:

I second that GOOD LUCK TO YOU ALL - I'll be there cheering you all on :hug: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[Peter]

What a fantastic day - sensational dancing, fantastic tunes, slick arrangements ...

So many stunning performances by forumites including DavidB & Lily, Martin & Lily & Janet, James & Mandy, Sheepman & Andy McG (the old gits), Sheena ....

Congratulations are due to so many for making it all such great fun ...

And massive congratulations to Adam and Mandy, the driving force behind the URBAN METRO team cabaret success. It can't be often that the judges make a unanimous decision. Many thanks to you both for your enormous efforts - the team has totally consumed them for 3 months - Mandy told me that she has not made a hot meal for her daughter since we started practising in January! Watch out Bristol - URBAN METRO will be droppping by in July

[Minnie M]

Nice meeting you tonight Peter :hug: look forward to a dance in Torquay :flower:

There are going to be so many comment about the champs - I am going to start a new thread - hopefully Franck or one of the moderaters will put your post onto the new thread,

Lynda

[Gareth]

In the end it was just the cleaners who were scrubbed.

I like the notices at the door which said no chewing gum:D

Explain that to my partner who spent 5 minutes removing the offending material from the bottom of her dance shoes.:confused: