Computer locked up - problem with Vista

[ShinyWeeStar]

Dad's been having problems sorting this out - hoping someone here can help...

Relative has been given a computer, HP Pavilion running Vista, about two years old, passed on from a friend who upgraded. There is no backup disk but with it being a relatively new machine there should be a backup of Vista on the smaller D drive, although this is only speculation. The computer has valuable photos on it which are not backed up elsewhere!!!

Problem started with download of latest Service Pack for Vista.
On trying to restart it goes to recovery screen (Insert Disk to repair, Safe Mode, latest working start, normal start).

Won't open with any of these, just get a countdown of loading 99,000 Windows files (exe, dll etc) along top of a black screen. Stops at 37543.

Won't open in safe mode - stops after two or three screens of loading at accept(?)

Won't open in System Restore F10 at startup. Did open with F5, tried to restore defaults but no success.

Downloaded the Vista Rescue disk. Computer did not boot off of the disk in the CD/DVD drive. Used the F1 key on startup - the boot order is floppy disk (but none installed), then the CD/DVD drive, then the hard drive.

As the command prompt could not be accessed tried using an old Me disk (the only full Windows Programme disk available) and this gave access to the command prompt, which means an instruction can be input to c:\ or d:\ . Can this be used to start up the backup which is believed will be on the D Drive? Or to restart Vista itself?

Alternatively there is the option to install Me in place of Vista – but would doing this delete the photos on the C Drive which we would want to recover? An upgrade from Me to XP is also available which would be quite acceptable.

Reformatting would not appear to be an option because there is no disc for Vista available – not to mention the photos which need to be recovered if at all possible.

Possibly another alternative – an external hard disk is available. Could a copy of Me (or Me updated to XP) be put on to this external hard drive, and the PC instructed to open from that drive? Would the photos be accessible that way?)

Getting Vista itself back is not important – XP would be preferred anyway!

Thanks. :flower:

[pmjd]

Best recovery method would be to use a linux boot disc like ubuntu (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCD) which would allow you to start the computer up and run an operating system from the DVD drive. Which in turn allows you to find the pictures you want to save and transfer them to an external HDD.

If that fails I do have the kit (or will after tomorrow ;) ) to take the HDD out of the laptop and get all the info out of it directly but not sure when I'll be down your way.

Try asking around for a Vista CD, I have gotten XP CDs before from mailing lists like freecycle.org. If you can get an XP CD you can use your vista activation key (on the laptop somewhere) for it I think, I do have XP pro & home installation CDs if you need one.

[robd]

It sounds as though getting the photos is the priority rather than getting the PC back up and running.

Do you know which filesystem the disk was formatted in - NTFS, FAT32? Probably you may not but I think this might affect the accessibility of the files if you were to hook it up to another machine (I don't think ME can natively read NTFS filesystems but could be wrong)

The simplest way, assuming you have access to another PC, would be to hook up the disc drive from the 'broken' PC to the working one as a 'slave' drive (though I think most drives now are set to auto select) and then copy the files across from there. If you aren't used to fiddling with the innards of a PC this may appear a bit daunting and in that case I'd say to try and find a cheap, trustworthy local computer shop to do it for you - don't be taken in by rip-off 'data recovery' firms.

[pmjd]

Do you know which filesystem the disk was formatted in - NTFS, FAT32? Probably you may not but I think this might affect the accessibility of the files if you were to hook it up to another machine (I don't think ME can natively read NTFS filesystems but could be wrong)
It's Vista so it'll be NTFS which is not readable by ME but XP can.


The simplest way, assuming you have access to another PC, would be to hook up the disc drive from the 'broken' PC to the working one as a 'slave' drive (though I think most drives now are set to auto select) and then copy the files across from there. If you aren't used to fiddling with the innards of a PC this may appear a bit daunting and in that case I'd say to try and find a cheap, trustworthy local computer shop to do it for you - don't be taken in by rip-off 'data recovery' firms.
Pretty sure all HP Pavilions are laptops, so you'd need either a 2.5 -> 3.5 converter cable if it's and IDE drive. If the laptop has a SATA drive then you should be able to plug it in to another computer that has SATA connections inside without any converters.

[Lee Bartholomew]

It's Vista so it'll be NTFS which is not readable by ME but XP can.


Pretty sure all HP Pavilions are laptops

HP done a range of Pavillion desktop pc's too.

The other thing you can maybe do, is get an windows 7 disk and install that. Just make sure when you get to the options, you dont format but choose "keep old files".

[Trousers]

Just a thought if you connect a vista drive as an external drive XP keeps the security running so files in the various user folders such as My Documents are not easily accessible.

At least I couldn't do it and assumed it ws the security.

[bigdjiver]

It's Vista so it'll be NTFS which is not readable by ME but XP can.


Pretty sure all HP Pavilions are laptops, so you'd need either a 2.5 -> 3.5 converter cable if it's and IDE drive. If the laptop has a SATA drive then you should be able to plug it in to another computer that has SATA connections inside without any converters.This probably will not help thread problem.

I went to Maplins to get 2.5 to 3.5 cable but came away instead witha nifty USB device with its own power supply that can interface to a 3.5 or 2.5 drive, and to a SATA one at the same time. It can read/write two external devices and allow transfers between them.

I thought it was a bargain at 24.95

[ShinyWeeStar]

This is Wee Shiny Star's Dad replying as she is getting lost in the technicalities! (Not that I'm an expert but for once I know more than she does!!!)

Thanks for all your replies, I am very impressed! Perhaps if I come in now I can clarify a couple of points that are being bounced around.

First, it is an HP Pavilion tower, and I have no idea which file system it uses,though I did suspect it would be NTFS, so thanks for clarifying that.

Like Bigdjiver I too have a SATA / IDE unit as well as an external hard drive case which my old hard drive is in. Not sure if the unit will transfer data from one drive to another - could they use the USB through a hub?

[DavidB]

If you do get the disk connected to another PC, and the files are still not visible, then there are plenty of file recovery programs available. I used one called Digital Photo Recovery, but it doesn't appear to have been updated for a couple of years. Another one I've been recommended is ImageRecall.

If you do use one of these programs, then please make sure you recover the files to a different disk. I didn't, and ended up overwriting some files that hadn't been recovered yet.

And once you get the files recovered, copy them to a DVD, or an online photo archive site.

[Lee Bartholomew]

See if you can get hold of an old drive. Throw it in and install any OS you can get hold of on it, then set your origional drive as secondary and get the files off that way.

If the old drive has win98 or Me (shudder) on it all the better as 9/10 it will load up without a fresh install.

You might find it easier to get a USB key to back the files up on.

[bigdjiver]

This is Wee Shiny Star's Dad replying as she is getting lost in the technicalities! (Not that I'm an expert but for once I know more than she does!!!)

Thanks for all your replies, I am very impressed! Perhaps if I come in now I can clarify a couple of points that are being bounced around.

First, it is an HP Pavilion tower, and I have no idea which file system it uses,though I did suspect it would be NTFS, so thanks for clarifying that.

Like Bigdjiver I too have a SATA / IDE unit as well as an external hard drive case which my old hard drive is in. Not sure if the unit will transfer data from one drive to another - could they use the USB through a hub?If you have a working PC with a port you can plug a USB device into then you can plug this device into that.
ou can connect a SATA drive to it via one connection and/or an IDE drive to it vis another. The device includes an 2.5 to 3.5 adapter and has a power outlet for connecting to a 3.5 device.

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=48965


USB port

[FirstMove]

Hi ShinyWeeDad,

SWS says that you managed to use the ME disk to get to a c: / d: prompt. Can you navigate from here using DOS commands (i.e. 'cd' and 'dir') to where the picture files are stored?

If yes, then mostly the hard-disk is OK and the hook-up as a slave strategies will work. You can probably even re-install an operating system without destroying any data on the disk.

If no, you need to think about the more drastic approaches. :eek:

[Dreadful Scathe]

Hi Shiny

SO vista no longer boots but tries to with errors. The ME boot is a red herring as your disk is NTFS and effectively invisible, forget ME - destroy the disk immediately. :) Easiest solution is to download an ubuntu live CD here (http://www.ubuntu.com/GetUbuntu/download), boot from it, check you can still see your pictures, though i dont see why not, and back them up to some usb device. I then recommend you install ubuntu after formatting the entire hard drive. No really.

or linux mint is nice - ill happily send you boot cds/dvds to try, just give me an address ;)

[Lee Bartholomew]

Hi Shiny

SO vista no longer boots but tries to with errors. The ME boot is a red herring as your disk is NTFS and effectively invisible, forget ME - destroy the disk immediately. :) Easiest solution is to download an ubuntu live CD here (http://www.ubuntu.com/GetUbuntu/download), boot from it, check you can still see your pictures, though i dont see why not, and back them up to some usb device. I then recommend you install ubuntu after formatting the entire hard drive. No really.

or linux mint is nice - ill happily send you boot cds/dvds to try, just give me an address ;)


If it's installed on a second disk there is a way around it (which I can't remember off the top of my head)

But Ubantu is prob the best way forward :grin:

[bigdjiver]

This is Wee Shiny Star's Dad replying as she is getting lost in the technicalities! (Not that I'm an expert but for once I know more than she does!!!)...

... Like Bigdjiver I too have a SATA / IDE unit as well as an external hard drive case which my old hard drive is in. Not sure if the unit will transfer data from one drive to another - could they use the USB through a hub?If it were I ...

I would beg, borrow or make other arrangements to get access to a working PC with XP or Vista.

If allowed to open that PC I would mount the dud HD in that as a slave drive and copy anything I wanted to off of it, probably to a USB memory stick.

If I was not allowed, or too worried to open the case I would by a device similar to the one I mentioned and use that to access the files I wanted to save.

Restoring the duff Vista disk to life is beyond my expertise.

Good luck

[Dreadful Scathe]

If it were I ...

I would beg, borrow or make other arrangements to get access to a working PC with XP or Vista.

If allowed to open that PC I would mount the dud HD in that as a slave drive and copy anything I wanted to off of it, probably to a USB memory stick.


why complicate matters? just boot from a linux live cd and copy the files off via usb. Simples.

[bigdjiver]

why complicate matters? just boot from a linux live cd and copy the files off via usb. Simples.Apologies, I was not aware that the Shineys had any experience of Linux whatsoever, or the expertise to know Linux live would have a similar interface to Windows. The last time I booted a Linux recovery disk (a good while ago) I was faced with a command prompt and did not even know what the command for help was.

[Dreadful Scathe]

Apologies, I was not aware that the Shineys had any experience of Linux whatsoever, or the expertise to know Linux live would have a similar interface to Windows. The last time I booted a Linux recovery disk (a good while ago) I was faced with a command prompt and did not even know what the command for help was.

those days are gone, it boots from cd straight to a very familiar looking desktop - no linux experience needed nowadays.

[ShinyWeeStar]

Thanks to everyone who replied. It was very interesting to read the different alternatives suggested!

As it is my son’s PC (on which I tried to download the SP for Vista) which has the problem I decided to try the easy way first and downloaded Ubuntu. After digging around to find why the ISO file I burned to a CD didn’t work (this shows how limited my knowledge of such things was!) I found that I needed a special burner to download these ISO files to a CD to open them up as Nero 6 didn’t do it. Maybe this explains why the ISO Vista Recovery Disk didn’t work either……………..

Anyway, I tried Ubuntu on the locked PC last night and it worked! I have managed to copy one Video to a pen and open it on my own PC but as it is only a 4gb pen I will be making a couple of trips to recover all the valuable files. After I get them I will try the Recovery Disk and hopefully get things back up and running. I’ll let you know.

I have copied all your replies as who knows, I may need this in the future – I never discard any useful tips!

Once again, my grateful thanks for all your suggestions and offers of help.

Shiny Wee Star’s Dad

[ShinyWeeStar]

Re the problem with the locked up PC running Vista after trying to install the latest Service Pack. Ubuntu worked perfectly and enabled me to recover the photos etc from the hard drive. Great programme!

However, the Vista Recovery Disk could not repair the damage nor would the only System Recovery it offered (the one created before the download of the Vista Service Pack) work.

It has now been decided that we install XP, which we have on disc, and my question now is – without individual drivers for all the hardware (graphics/sound cards etc) for that specific machine am I better letting XP just replace Vista, which it says it can do and presumably will retain the existing drivers, or can I format the drive and let XP install drivers itself (I don’t know if XP has drivers for all the hardware – this was one of the early machines with Vista)?

I have access to a copy of Paretologic Driver Cure which searches for missing drivers. Would that pick up any missing ones?

Shiny Wee Star’s Dad.

[Lee Bartholomew]

Vista wont let you install XP over the top of it.

You can put it on a seperate partition or you'll have to format, eitherway, you will have to re-install drivers.

If you can get a net connection, it's best to download the drivers first esp for your wireless if you have one, as you wont be able to connect to the internet without it!

:nice:

[Dreadful Scathe]

It has now been decided that we install XP, which we have on disc, and my question now is – without individual drivers for all the hardware (graphics/sound cards etc) for that specific machine am I better letting XP just replace Vista, which it says it can do and presumably will retain the existing drivers, or can I format the drive and let XP install drivers itself (I don’t know if XP has drivers for all the hardware – this was one of the early machines with Vista)?

As Lee says you cant install XP "over the top of Vista" - the default option will be to install it on the same drive - which would give you a dual boot of "working Xp" or "broken Vista"...pointless. Best to format the whole thing but you will almost certaily need some drivers, most you will be able to get from your motherboard manufacturers site, or if its a badged PC like a Dell, from their site.

However, i strongly advise you to download Linux Mint and use that instead, much less hassle. Boot from the DVD and and see if it picks up all your drivers, it usually does. If you like it, install it after formatting the drive. Its a FAR easier install than XP. And you can select extra programs you may need simply by selecting "software manager" and once you install "wine" you can install windows programs too. Really simply. Go on, go for it.

(ubuntu is good too, but linux mint defaults are more helpful to newcomers)

[ShinyWeeStar]

I’ve just been down on my knees looking for a Serial No. before going on to the HP site to see if there was anything there about drivers and found a couple of small labels – one says ‘Designed for Windows XP. Vista capable’. The other is an XP label with the installation Key number.

It looks like the computer was designed for XP but either upgraded to Vista by the retailer or, less likely, by the previous owner.



Can you see there being any problems in installing XP after formatting?

[Lee Bartholomew]

However, i strongly advise you to download Linux Mint and use that instead, much less hassle. Boot from the DVD and and see if it picks up all your drivers, it usually does. If you like it, install it after formatting the drive. Its a FAR easier install than XP. And you can select extra programs you may need simply by selecting "software manager" and once you install "wine" you can install windows programs too. Really simply. Go on, go for it.



Might give that a go on the 2nd PC im building :nice: