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View Full Version : (The lack of) Public transport information on organiser's web sites



Spin dryer
15th-April-2007, 11:01 AM
Moderator Note: This thread has been split from the Chill thread (http://www.cerocscotland.com/forum/social-events/8619-whos-going-chill-prestatyn-20-22-april-2007-a.html) to attract a more general discussion...

[...]

Given that significant numbers of people do travel to weekenders by train, I think that it would be helpful if the organisers gave a little more detailed and accurate information about train travel.

NB If you do take the train to Prestatyn, please note that most services are not direct. The non direct services take around an hour longer.

Spin dryer
15th-April-2007, 11:39 AM
For anyone who is thinking of going up by train, the direct train from Euston to Prestatyn takes just 2 hours 30 minutes (as opposed to say 4 hours 30 minutes by car). Bizarrely, the ceroc site recommends going to Rhyl, which takes longer, involves changes and costs more (they say £58 as opposed to the £30 my return to Prestatyn cost me).


....and Prestatyn station is just 600 metres (ie walking distance) from the venue, whereas Rhyl is 4.5miles.

Astro
15th-April-2007, 12:56 PM
....and Prestatyn station is just 600 metres (ie walking distance) from the venue, whereas Rhyl is 4.5miles.

Yes, I find all the ceroc websites frustrating. It's always cars, cars, cars.
Public transport is an afterthought, if at all.:angry: :angry: :angry:

ducasi
15th-April-2007, 02:02 PM
For anyone who is thinking of going up by train, the direct train from Euston to Prestatyn takes just 2 hours 30 minutes (as opposed to say 4 hours 30 minutes by car). Bizarrely, the ceroc site recommends going to Rhyl, which takes longer, involves changes and costs more (they say £58 as opposed to the £30 my return to Prestatyn cost me).

[...]

NB If you do take the train to Prestatyn, please note that most services are not direct. The non direct services take around an hour longer.
Hmm... The Ceroc Chill web site says this...

There are two train stations relatively near the Pontins site. Prestatyn is the nearest. However the fares to Rhyl station are cheaper and you change less times.

For example:

London Euston to Rhyl is £58 return and takes less than three hours
From Glasgow, going to Rhyl or Prestatyn, the only difference is that the trains gets into Rhyl 6 minutes after Prestayn – it is otherwise identical journeys and identical prices (£91.10 "saver return").

And I found the very same for between Euston & Rhyl or Prestatyn, direct or indirect, same route, same price (£62.70 "saver return"), every train passing through Prestatyn 6 minutes before arriving at Rhyl.

Not saying you or Ceroc are wrong – maybe you found routes, times or fares I missed.

Spin dryer
15th-April-2007, 02:15 PM
Hmm... The Ceroc Chill web site says this...

From Glasgow, going to Rhyl or Prestatyn, the only difference is that the trains gets into Rhyl 6 minutes after Prestayn – it is otherwise identical journeys and identical prices (£91.10 "saver return").

And I found the very same for between Euston & Rhyl or Prestatyn, direct or indirect, same route, same price (£62.70 "saver return"), every train passing through Prestatyn 6 minutes before arriving at Rhyl.

Not saying you or Ceroc are wrong – maybe you found routes, times or fares I missed.

The conflicting information that you obtained illustrates what a shambles the railways have become since privatisation. If you check prices online, you get prices such as those you cite. If you ring up Virgin, you get the price of £30 return that I paid (though this might not now be available given that we are less than a week from the event).

All this confusion means that it's very hard for non regular rail users to get a decent deal. All the more reason then for event organisers to do more research and share the information with us all. It's a real chore for everyone to have to reinvent the wheel at every event. To give another example, the complete absence of rail information for Southport means that at each weekender a number of poor souls end up at Southport station rather than the correct station of Ainsdale.

Back to Prestatyn, it would have been helpful for ceroc to have advised that it is possible to get a direct train to Prestatyn. It's a bit of a pain having to change en route and then having to get a taxi from Rhyl.

Spin dryer
15th-April-2007, 04:02 PM
Hmm... The Ceroc Chill web site says this...

From Glasgow, going to Rhyl or Prestatyn, the only difference is that the trains gets into Rhyl 6 minutes after Prestayn – it is otherwise identical journeys and identical prices (£91.10 "saver return").

And I found the very same for between Euston & Rhyl or Prestatyn, direct or indirect, same route, same price (£62.70 "saver return"), every train passing through Prestatyn 6 minutes before arriving at Rhyl.

Not saying you or Ceroc are wrong – maybe you found routes, times or fares I missed.

I've checked with Virgin. You are correct Ducasi; tickets are now only available at £62.70 return from London. It's worth bearing in mind for the future that you can obtain tickets for less than half this price if you book some time in advance (my tickets were bought on 12 March for £31). Even at £62.70, it's cheaper than the petrol if you're travelling alone, and much quicker.

Astro
16th-April-2007, 11:40 AM
All this confusion means that it's very hard for non regular rail users to get a decent deal. All the more reason then for event organisers to do more research and share the information with us all. It's a real chore for everyone to have to reinvent the wheel at every event. To give another example, the complete absence of rail information for Southport means that at each weekender a number of poor souls end up at Southport station rather than the correct station of Ainsdale.


The problem is that most organisers have to have a car for their job and they just don't realise that not everyone else has one. Wake up!

Especially city folk, who have great transport systems and don't need cars, are the ones who need clear consise information to these coastal areas. Unlike country folk, where there is often only one bus a week, who really do need a car.

Descriptions for car drivers are given in minute detail, whereas public transport is hit and miss.

I notice on the Champs leaflet that the DLR Limehouse, which is very near The Troxy, is described as a train station. Which it is mainline BUT locals (and I'm sure Spindryer knows) know that the DLR is more of a tube system - it being on the tube map.

ducasi
16th-April-2007, 12:02 PM
Descriptions for car drivers are given in minute detail, whereas public transport is hit and miss.
To be fair, the directions for car driver to Chill aren't given in that much detail... There's about 4 times as much space on the page given over to travelling by train compared to travelling by car.

(They also have information on how to get to Blackpool by coach, perhaps for an alternative holiday in case you didn't get booked for Chill. :D)

But yeah, rather than fill up their pages with adverts for train and bus companies, a bit more useful information wouldn't go amiss...

(Moderator hat on: if there's much more discussion on this subject on this thread, I might split it into a new thread. Thoughts?)

Spin dryer
16th-April-2007, 05:00 PM
(Moderator hat on: if there's much more discussion on this subject on this thread, I might split it into a new thread. Thoughts?)

Yes, a new thread would be a good idea.

Another good resource is "Traintaxi" a database and guide that:

lists all the train, metro, tram and underground stations in Britain

shows whether each station has a taxi rank or cab office

lists up to three local taxi or cab firms serving each station.

traintaxi limited (http://www.traintaxi.co.uk/)

Astro
17th-April-2007, 11:21 AM
I've had a proper look at the Ceroc Champs at the Troxy travel details. (according to the Booking Form leaflet) (Have not checked website).

This obviously was not written by anyone who uses public transport.

Limehouse DLR/mainline Station is about 2 mins walk to the Troxy.
Limehouse DLR is classed as a tube by Londoners. It is 2 stops from Bank Underground/DLR. Bank is on the DLR, plus Central line and Northern lines.

So anyone travelling into London on a mainline train needs to head for Bank Underground Station. (Excepting coming from Southend to Fenchurch St. where Limehouse is a mainline C2C station).

There is absolutely no point going to Stepney Green or Mile End Undergrounds.
Even Algate East Underground would have been a better option as it connects with the 15 bus.

bigdjiver
17th-April-2007, 03:27 PM
It is not just the organisers that are poor at giving out public transport information. I have yet to find a bus operator who has all of their timetables and a route map on the WWW. The rail timetable site is very good, but still lacks a route map. I have had no joy whatsoever in trying to link up a mix of bus and rail to get to a destination.

Blind_Dynamo
17th-April-2007, 03:48 PM
It is not just the organisers that are poor at giving out public transport information. I have yet to find a bus operator who has all of their timetables and a route map on the WWW. The rail timetable site is very good, but still lacks a route map. I have had no joy whatsoever in trying to link up a mix of bus and rail to get to a destination.

I've had the same problem being disabled and able to drive I rely on public transport and you will find that there not much co ordination between services and they vary enormously through out the country.

I use this website Welcome to UK RAILWAYS on the Net (http://www.rail.co.uk) and click on the transportdirect link or call travelline on 08706082608 I find them helpful.

TA Guy
17th-April-2007, 04:32 PM
Transport Direct - Britain's free online journey planner (http://www.transportdirect.co.uk/TransportDirect/en/)

I can confirm this is a useful site.

As is; National Rail Enquiries - Official source for rail information, UK train times and timetables (http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/)
Which I think is a great web site. The only downside being, that as mentioned above, the fares they quote are often inaccurate. (E.G. Saver return from my place to St. Albans on that web site quoted as 38.?? and same ticket actually cost me 43.50 same day at the ticket office). But it does include short notice alterations due to rail work and stuff, and does include info where buses are substituted for trains etc.
The live departure boards can be extremely useful too, although you have to remember trains can make time up (!!!!). Only helpful for long journeys, but knowing your 12:30 from Portsmouth to Cardiff is running 60 mins late can be helpful.

Stuart
17th-April-2007, 04:46 PM
I've found this site useful before when planning bus journeys:

Traveline (http://www.traveline.org.uk/index.htm). It got me from Rye station to Camber and also from Chippenham station to Devizes.