Justification for Banning

[Gus]

My own personal experineces (from both sides) and some recent un-ethical activites in the East have pulled the question of banning to my mind again. I know there is a wide variation of thoughts on this. So ... could you please confirm which deeds you think someone should justifiably be banned from a venue for.

[Gus]

Just heard a new reason for banning..... repeatedly trying to sneak in to a club night without paying:tears: Can you believe that an adult would do this? So far this takes the biscuit for the Dumbest Person To Get Banned :wink:

[Andy McGregor]

This is an easy one. I think that the clear indication for banning someone is the answer to the question below;

Are they damaging the business?

If the answer is yes ban them. Simple.

The business is there to make money. If someone takes an action that means even 2 people stop going the amount of money that business makes will be reduced.

Of course you have to be careful. It is purely a business decision. If someone is popular and you ban them because they're a man turning up dressed as a woman :innocent: you might lose money when a whole crowd of people stop coming.

But, once you make it a business decision it stops being personal and becomes financial. Which is easier for the person being banned to understand.

The only problem I can see with banning is that there is no appeal. It is up to the owner of the business to decide to ban someone and to stand by his decision. I recently had a 'I'm thinking about banning you discussion'. One of my friends moved back to the area and having bought a new house gave me his new 'phone number at a class. The following day a was accused of 'collecting 'phone numbers for future use' with the implication that I would be banned for it. I was not happy about it as I felt completely innocent - but the 'businessman' is free do do what he thinks is right for his business. I wasn't banned but have been back only once when the alternative night I now go to was closed for an event.

Of course, if you applied this business rule completely you might end up banning some teachers or even, God forbid, the DJ:devil: :devil: :devil:

p.s. How much more do I have to do to be offered the job of Apprentice ODA?;)

[Dreadful Scathe]

Whats wrong with using the venue solely as a pick up joint ? good way to meet people if you ask me, and you do still have to dance i assume - talking on the dance floor is something else entirely :D

[Gadget]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
Whats wrong with using the venue solely as a pick up joint ? good way to meet people if you ask me, and you do still have to dance i assume - talking on the dance floor is something else entirely :D
I think it's more to do with the way most men try to pick up women {by their ears? :innocent::devil:} and the 'creep' factor of being hit on while dancing.

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
If someone is popular and you ban them because they're a man turning up dressed as a woman :innocent: you might lose money when a whole crowd of people stop coming.
p.s. How much more do I have to do to be offered the job of Apprentice ODA?;)
Andy, sounds like you're feeling a little guilty here, but aren't there venues down your way where it is compulsory to cross dress? :devil:
And re. apprentice ODA, no chance yet, so far your arguments are far too logical and well reasoned. . .

Re. using the venue solely as a pick up joint, I also don't really see how this happens. (Am I too young and innocent?) Some dancing must be involved, unless there are some guys (is that sexist?) who just spend their time chatting and escorting partners away. In which case why not go to more likely clubbing venues (so I'm told - maybe I'm wrong - perhaps jivers are easy!) Help - I think I'm running into trouble with this train of thought.
Greg

[bigdjiver]

I have twice experienced just-for-pickup ladies, that I know of. Each time the girl gave me the big come on in the beginners lesson - which is definitely not the norm. I looked at her subsequent behaviour, and every partner I saw her with was getting it too. Both girls left before the end of the lesson with man in tow. They were both stunning lookers. For all I know they could have been "trade". If so, they were not around long enough to be banned.

I know a couple of guys who seem to be scorecarding the ladies, and cause many tears, but they are both excellent dancers.

[Gus]

Originally posted by Sheepman
Andy, sounds like you're feeling a little guilty here, but aren't

Re. using the venue solely as a pick up joint, I also don't really see how this happens


Sad to say this is a lot more prevelant than you would imagine ... especially down in London. There are a lot of pople who come to Ceroc after divroce or similar to restart social life etc. There is one chap in particular I found out about (from two of his victims) who spot these ladies, applies all the right lines and then beds them for as long as he's entertained. Surely this is someone who deserves to have the living cr*p beaten out of him?




And re. apprentice ODA, no chance yet, so far your arguments are far too logical and well reasoned. . .
Greg

Once more I'm afraid you have failed to see what is happeneing in the world around you. The whole idea of the ODA is to propose a counter argument ... just because you may not agree with the argument does not invalidate it :grin:

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by Gus
I found out about (from two of his victims) who spot these ladies, applies all the right lines and then beds them for as long as he's entertained. Surely this is someone who deserves to have the living cr*p beaten out of him?

I think thats a bit harsh. Its adults we are talking about here, people have to make their own decisions on who they go home with. Cads will be found out, you meet plenty of those in ANY social situation and the big advantage of dance nights is that they'll be labelled as cads the first time they behave in this way meaning they are less likely to pull the same stunt - or the 'targets' are at least forewarned. People who use other people eventually get their comeuppance.

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Gus
There are a lot of pople who come to Ceroc after divroce or similar to restart social life etc. There is one chap in particular I found out about (from two of his victims) [B]

I know of a few guys like this, one of whom is a popular dancer, but I couldn't say they use the venue SOLELY as a pickup joint.
And as DS says, we are all adults, (though some maybe particularly vulnerable when, as you say, they are restarting their social lives.)


Once more I'm afraid you have failed to see what is happeneing in the world around you. The whole idea of the ODA is to propose a counter argument ... just because you may not agree with the argument does not invalidate it :grin:
Ouch! And surely this position sometimes leads to irony!:rolleyes:

Greg

[Will]

How come that the main menu tells me that the last post in this thread is on the 14th July, yet when I read it the last post is dated 9th July? Anyone have any ideas?:confused:

(Obviously that was the case before I posted this post)

[Gus]

Will, think this has something to do with a buggette that affacts polls. I think that the system counts the last poll vote as a post timewise so there will alwys appear to be a phantom posting...

Anyway, now that you've drawn our attention back to the post ... think its about time some franchisees shared their views openly. Personally I'l surprised (appalled?) that 4 voters seem to think that groping is allowable and 7 voters dont think dangerous dancing is so much of a problem..:confused:

[DavidB]

Originally posted by Gus
Personally I'l surprised (appalled?) that 4 voters seem to think that groping is allowable and 7 voters dont think dangerous dancing is so much of a problem.. I doubt it - it is just that some people may not have realised they could select several different options in the poll

[Dreadful Scathe]

.
Originally posted by DavidB
I doubt it - it is just that some people may not have realised they could select several different options in the poll

of course, everyones done that at some point - and then there will be the people who voted for the one they thought was most important. Anyway, groping is a valid part of the dance surely - at least i never complain about it anyway, got to give the followers a chance to express themselves after all :D .

[Lou]

Originally posted by Gus
Personally I'l surprised (appalled?) that 4 voters seem to think that groping is allowable and 7 voters dont think dangerous dancing is so much of a problem..:confused: Alternatively, they may well feel that groping / dangerous dancing is unacceptable, however banning is not necessarily the right solution? (Banning being only suitable as a last resort when fashion crimes have been committed, for instance)

[Chicklet]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
. . Anyway, groping is a valid part of the dance surely - at least i never complain about it anyway, got to give the followers a chance to express themselves after all :D .

aha - Alles Klar, I wondered why my little friend said she like dancing with you:devil:

[CJ]

Originally posted by Chicklet
aha - Alles Klar, I wondered why my little friend said she like dancing with you:devil:

Not because she, too, is little?????

BTW, he's nae bad at the old bit following lark noo, 'n' that.

[Graham]

Originally posted by Chicklet
aha - Alles Klar, I wondered why my little friend said she like dancing with you:devil: Are you saying his dancing is so awful that a few "unorthodox" hand positions is the only explanation for her enjoyment?

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by Chicklet
aha - Alles Klar, I wondered why my little friend said she like dancing with you:devil:

ich genoß, mit hübschem Mädchen zu tanzen :)

[Chicklet]

Originally posted by Graham
Are you saying his dancing is so awful that a few "unorthodox" hand positions is the only explanation for her enjoyment? no, of course not:eek: I'm saying that he was obviously putting that little extra something into the experience.


NB LOVE "unorthodox hand positions", as a turn of phrase, obviously.

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by Chicklet
NB LOVE "unorthodox hand positions", as a turn of phrase, obviously.

Im sure I recall your words when we danced were along the lines of
'my, thats an unorthodox hand pos...wooooooo'

[Chicklet]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
'my, thats an unorthodox hand pos...wooooooo'
gosh, you didn't take that as a complaint did you???:eek:

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by Gus
Once more I'm afraid you have failed to see what is happeneing in the world around you. The whole idea of the ODA is to propose a counter argument ... just because you may not agree with the argument does not invalidate it :grin:

I agree with Gus. And I'll take it even further. To be a good ODA you don't even have to agree with your own counter argument. Your objective should be to propose something, have an argument why it should be that way and then get shot down in flames - at least that's how it seems to work on this Forum
:devil:

[Gus]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
I agree with Gus. And I'll take it even further. To be a good ODA you don't even have to agree with your own counter argument. Your objective should be to propose something, have an argument why it should be that way and then get shot down in flames - at least that's how it seems to work on this Forum
:devil:

Aha Grasshoper ... enlightenment is attained :grin:

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by Gus
Aha Grasshoper ... enlightenment is attained :grin:

Do I have to do that thing with my forearms and the red hot Hibachi now?:waycool:

I already knew what the ODA was all about, and I knew Gus knew I knew. But from comments I've seen here I wasn't certain that others competely understood. Some people seem to have occasionally taken umbrage at some of this particular Satan's postulations. It's all a game, just join in :devil:

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
To be a good ODA you don't even have to agree with your own counter argument. Your objective should be to propose something
There you go again Andy, I can't argue with that, far too logical to attain the rank of ODA! :grin: :grin:

greg

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
But from comments I've seen here I wasn't certain that others competely understood. Some people seem to have occasionally taken umbrage at some of this particular Satan's postulations. It's all a game, just join in :devil:

Yes Ive noticed that :) just occasionaly though, i think people have replied with indignation at the point rather than Gus personally, and the rest must assume he believes everything he posts. :) You wouldnt catch me posting controversial topics.

So, abortion - good or bad ? :)

[Sheepman]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
So, abortion - good or bad ? :)
Yes!

Can I be OBL (Official Boot Licker)?:drool: :drool:
Greg

[Graham]

Originally posted by Gus
Personally I'l surprised (appalled?) that 4 voters seem to think that groping is allowable Now up to 7. Franck - are any of these people women?


And, if so, where do they dance? :devil:

[Franck]

Originally posted by Graham
Now up to 7. Franck - are any of these people women? Well... :devil: now you mention it, 2 women didn't tick that option... but I'm too much of a gentleman to reveal who :wink: or maybe, I'm keeping that info all to myself :innocent:

I suspect though that a few people didn't realise they could select several options, or that maybe, banning was too soft :really:

Franck.

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by Franck

I suspect though that a few people didn't realise they could select several options, or that maybe, banning was too soft :really:

Franck.

Quite right, banning is the soft option. Castration would be too soft for some gropers I've been molested by:what: And in my case my breasts are made of foam filled latex, who knows how I'd feel if they were real:devil:

[Pammy]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
.

Anyway, groping is a valid part of the dance surely - at least i never complain about it anyway, got to give the followers a chance to express themselves after all :D .

Depends who's doing the groping!

I've definitely been groped by someone who you wouldn't enjoy being groped by!

[xSalsa_Angelx]

if someone I did not like tried to grope me think I would just have to add in a new ceroc move .... the flying punch :rofl:

[Pammy]

Originally posted by xSalsa_Angelx
if someone I did not like tried to grope me think I would just have to add in a new ceroc move .... the flying punch :rofl:

Good point. You could follow that up with, "Oh, don't you know that move?? Well I was sure you gave the right signal for it!"

[xSalsa_Angelx]

Originally posted by Pammy
Good point. You could follow that up with, "Oh, don't you know that move?? Well I was sure you gave the right signal for it!"

Good One Pammy :rofl:

[Graham]

Originally posted by xSalsa_Angelx
if someone I did not like tried to grope me I'll be sure to establish whether you like me before leading that particular signal then!

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by xSalsa_Angelx
if someone I did not like tried to grope me think I would just have to add in a new ceroc move .... the flying punch :rofl:

And if you liked us and we didn't grope you would you be even slightly disappointed?:wink:

Maybe we need a 'feel free to grope me' signal :devil:

[Chicklet]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
Maybe we need a 'feel free to grope me' signal :devil:

Surely that's "Hello, my name's Steve, I'm a beginner"???

[Pammy]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
Maybe we need a 'feel free to grope me' signal :devil: [/B]


And how would it go, just so we are all familiar and recognise it for the future.... :D

[xSalsa_Angelx]

Originally posted by Graham
I'll be sure to establish whether you like me before leading that particular signal then!

:rofl: I would Na do that move to you Graham.....!!! :D

[Andy McGregor]

Anyone remember what this thread was about?

Anyone care?:innocent:

[Pammy]

Originally posted by Andy McGregor
Anyone remember what this thread was about?

Anyone care?:innocent:

Blame Greg, mention a shrunken head or toilet roll, then there's no stopping the man!!! :rofl:

[MartinHarper]

The sadness about banning people for "Teaching at a rival club" is that there are some great dancers out there, who would make great teachers, who avoid doing so because they don't want to deal with bans and similar nonsense. Everyone loses.

[Beowulf]

IMHO,

Being a sleaze (groping etc), being an idiot (Dangerous moves) or being a thug (fighting etc) would be all good grounds for a banning.

IMHO that is :)

[Beowulf]

oh yeah.. can I just add one more ban worthy offence?

(I noticed this last night .. two chaps doing it.. don't think they are forumites though.. but you never know)

Gents. When you nip to the toilet between dances.. PLEASE REMEMBER TO WASH YOUR HANDS :sick: you'd be disgusted to count the number of guys that DON'T do this.. :sick:

It sickens me.. and I feel sorry for any followers having to hold hands with them afterwards. :mad:

[TheTramp]

Doesn't that apply to the followers too Beo? :D

[Beowulf]

Doesn't that apply to the followers too Beo? :D

well yes.. but I'm not in the habit of following ladies into the toilet (despite what people say.. that charge was not-proven due to lack of reliable witnesses!! :wink: :D ) so I wouldn't know WHAT goes on in there.

:D

[TheTramp]

well yes.. but I'm not in the habit of following ladies into the toilet (despite what people say.. that charge was not-proven due to lack of reliable witnesses!! :wink: :D ) so I wouldn't know WHAT goes on in there.

:D

I think that it's the same as ours, but with rose petals.... :waycool: