No going back!

[Lory]

No going back (the 10,000th thread... as Trampy pointed out :))


At the risk of sounding like the worst case Hotshot ever to have graced the dance floor, I'm going to bare my soul...


I have found there is a sad price to pay for experiencing the best of the best


Once upon a time, I could get my kicks from almost any music (yes, even monotonous pop) and from almost anyone who could string a few beginner moves together.

The naivity of not being aware of my inherent faults, gave me a confidence that i've since lost.

Gaining knowledge about how one 'should' be able to follow precisely, using the correct frame, tension, compression, floor pressure and visual leads, can make one too self critical.

Watching video's of perfectly executed choreographed routines, gives unrealistic goals to aim at.

Dancing with people who have the ability to unite you with them AND the music, is an exquisite experience, that once experienced, can never be forgotten and will always be aspired to but rarely achieved

I'm envious of those who haven't yet experienced the weekender blues room phenomenon or those who are still making discoveries, as once experinced you can never go back..

Also, think carefully when embarking on learning a new dance style, or two, or three, as they can end up just being a constant source of frustration, as so few other people can do them.

[TheTramp]

No going back (the 2000th thread )


Should that be 10,000th? :flower:

(Of course, if you change it now, no-one will know what I'm going on about!)

[Lory]

Should that be 10,000th? :flower:

(Of course, if you change it now, no-one will know what I'm going on about!)

You're quite right! :worthy:

[TheTramp]

Your'e quite right! :worthy:

First for everything! :yum:

[TheTramp]

I'm envious of those who haven't yet experienced the weekender blues room phenomenon or those who are still making discoveries, as once experinced you can never go back..


'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

So, having experienced it once (or more times), you'd prefer never to have experienced it, rather than have other dances which don't quite match up be adversely coloured by the experience?

You're right. Nothing comes close to THAT dance to THAT music, with THAT dance partner. However, I have enough of those to look forward to, that I can enjoy almost all the dances I have to whatever music. I think that it must be different for followers though :hug:

[LMC]

:yeah:

If you've experienced it once... then you know "you can do it" and maybe it will happen again :nice:

My leading isn't good enough to be 100% sure, but I think it probably is very different for followers as the leader is 'in control' of the dance. It is very depressing to be pretzelled or mangled to oblivion through a beautiful blues track, even if the lead is leading the moves perfectly and on time :sick: :tears:

[MartinHarper]

Think carefully when embarking on learning a new dance style, or two, or three, as they can end up just being a constant source of frustration, as so few other people can do them.

When learning new dances:
1. Learn dances that other people dance. Salsa, not Outer Hebridean Three Step. These dances will vary based on your local area.
2. Go to events organised for that dance. If you want to dance Lindy, go to GNSH, not Storm.
3. Try not to consider one dance as "better" than another. (note to self: this means I should try not to consider following as "better" than leading).

[DJ Andy]

Also, think carefully when embarking on learning a new dance style, or two, or three, as they can end up just being a constant source of frustration, as so few other people can do them.

But by never trying new dance styles you might always be left wondering 'what if' or 'I wonder if I could have been any good at...Salsa/Tango/Lindy/WCS etc.'

You'd miss the chance to refine your knowledge of what you really like (or hate!) about different dance styles and their music genres.

And if you followed that argument many people wouldn't have tried out Modern Jive or Ceroc!
Certainly when I was a beginner there was precious little MJ/Ceroc around.Then three years later when I was attempting to learn some Lindy Hop there was even less around!
Now fortunately it has grown in popularity (along with salsa et al)

Use your enthusiasm for your newly preferred dancestyles to encourage others and help to build up the numbers who will enjoy that which you enjoy.

:cheers:

[JiveLad]

No going back (the 10,000th thread... as Trampy pointed out :))

Dancing with people who have the ability to unite you with them AND the music, is an exquisite experience, that once experienced, can never be forgotten and will always be aspired to but rarely achieved .
------

Yes this is definitely the goal and is the subject of a lot of discussion in my entourage. Some of the conclusions are:

- the technical ability of the partner is not the overriding issue: more important is the connection (at all levels: mind/body/spirit) - eg. see my blog entry about the Jack Johnson dance. Being able to 'connect' can perhaps only happen when you have reached a certain level of competence (ideally unconscious competence, which will enable flow to happen - by flow I mean as in optimal experience as described by the psychologist Csiksentmihalyi) - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mihaly_Csikszentmihalyi)

- it works differently for different people: 'X' may be regarded as a great dancer for most people, but for 'Z' it just doesn't happen when dancing with 'X':

- having a 10/10 dance with a partner one night does not mean you will always have 10/10 dances with that partner (eg. see my blog entry about Christina Aguilera)

[Flat_Eric]

Hello Dear,

I know the place you are talking about only too well and have found myself there numerous times, for my dancing and also other areas of my life. As a matter of fact, I was there about 3 weeks ago. Being on the other side of the fence you read this, I'd like to offer you a number of ideas to play with that may help you explore your current experience of dance

Initial thoughts
- By doing all the things you've done to develop your knowledge of dance, you have created, consciously or not, a number of belief about what makes a good dance. It's by examining what you now believe a good dance is and possibly choosing if that belief has any use to you that you will be able to have a different sense of dancing

- Slightly more daring: every time I managed to get out of dance boredom and found myself reflecting upon what had stuck me there, I realised a number of things:
x My new paradigm was extraordinarily richer and more diverse than the previous one. It made it worth the wait
x I was in "that place" in my dancing, but also in my life. The reason being that there was something that I had not thought of challenging before and took for granted (as it: something that "has to be this way") that had in fact become out of date or inappropriate for my experience of the world. It was changing that simple but fundamental idea that the shift happened, smoothly easily and with a quantum leap in my perceptions and enjoyment of dancing and life

If you sense that any of the above applies for you, know this: you're about to learn something that will take your dancing to the next level, with a new universe of meaning and distinctions to play with, investigate, discover... Just stick to it and be quietly patient, it's there for you, probably pretty close...


Some questions to play with
1- Ok, you watched videos, had memorable dances, did all these things to get the feel of dance some more. What beliefs or expectations did that create in you.... In think about it, ideally jot down a list on paper.
=> Dance is like ...
=> A good dance is ...
=> A good dance has to be ...
=> What makes a good dance ....
=> I now believe this about what makes a good dance because ...

2- Having a look at this list of beliefs you have, ask yourself:
- Is that something I have always believed about dancing? Is that true? Always? Have there times in my life where this wasn't true and where I still enjoyed the dance
- What else could make a dance good?
- In other areas of my life, are there other areas where I experience fun consistently? How do I do it? Is it something I do in my dancing as well? If not, is there something that I could add to my experience of dancing? If I did, what would that be like?


Wine and me... A little story
As a Froggyland native whose grandparents where wine merchants, I got a classical wine education, done the French way. For my 7th birthday, I was given my first glass of red, an amazing French grand cru. That day, I thought: "Yeah ! That’s what wine is about ! World class bottles, grand receptions, wealth and fame!!". I started to work hard at school to make sure I could get all the wine I dream of. From as single glass, my first one, I had understood wine. Had I?

As the years went by, I had different experiences. Wines not as good, but that were a perfect match with the course eaten. Wines that were extraordinary, but that had been opened too soon. Or too late. Exquisite wines served at the wrong temperature. Wines that were average, but that I remember more fondly because of the person I shared them with, or the occasion, or for what they meant.

Age 25+, I was what you could call a French connoisseur, highly competent on French vineyards. This time, I knew. Did I?

When I came to live in England and started to go out, I discovered how people here would have "liquid dinners", drink 1 or 2-year old "full-bodied" bottles barely in their infancy whose primary taste left a sandpaper feeling on the tongue. I started to learn again, experience again. The price of the learning was to put what I had learned so far and to start again. The moment I did that, enjoyment came back immediately.

2 years ago, I even got myself hired at Oddbins for 3 months , besides my regular job, to complete the learning process and push the boundaries of my drinking experience, from one continent to the other, from one grape to the next. Every evening, I would by some bottles of red with the money I had just earned, go home and taste one of them (at least!! :grin: :respect: ). I quickly gained a reputation among customers for my savvy. This time I knew the stuff.... Did I?

Then I started to get questions from people about white wines, stouts, whiskeys, beverages I had never heard from.... I opened myself once more. As a result, I've started to drink white more regularly, something I had never done so far. I bacame able to appreciate it the moment I did not drink white in reference to red.

I'll tell you the best thing: the best thing is that, not matter what, my experience and taste change. There's a simple secret to it: time. What I like yesterday may not be what I like tomorrow, and what I drink today may influence what I drink tomorrow. As long as I keep my senses sharp and remember what makes this bottle unique and interesting by itself ate the very moment I drink it, no matter how top notch it is. And the glass of wine that I am most interested in is the one I am having now, or the next one if my glass is empty. I don't drink as often as I used to but know that I can whenever I wish to. I don't think I know of a feeling more liberating...


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

True for wine drinking, true for dancing. Someone told me once: "What I like when I dance with you is that I never have the same dance twice". Well, with my mood, my ideas, my body, the venue, the people at the venue, the music changing, how could it be otherwise? But the fact that this got mentioned and praised also told me that this is not something to be taken for granted and should therefore be valued.

Feel content with what you have while remaining hungry for some more.

Best,

FE

[MartinHarper]

The naivity of not being aware of my inherent faults, gave me a confidence that i've since lost.
Gaining knowledge about how one 'should' be able to follow precisely, using the correct frame, tension, compression, floor pressure and visual leads, can make one too self critical.

I'm still in the "ignorance is bliss" phase. However, should I ever lose that naivety, I intend to remember these words, stolen from another discussion board:


The best swing dance analogy I ever heard was this:

If dance is a conversation, then you should think about how you converse. Do you just go off the cuff and riff and go on tangents and stumble and come back and repeat yourself? The conversation still feel alive? Good.

Or do you spend countless hours fine-tuning every inflection, every word and syllable, going over and figuring out what those inflections and syllables mean to the other person, so that you can give that person the single most intensely understood conversation ever?

That's what I thought. Dancing should be more like the first one.

[Gus]

I have found there is a sad price to pay for experiencing the best of the best. Once upon a time, I could get my kicks from almost any music (yes, even monotonous pop) and from almost anyone who could string a few beginner moves together.Same feeling but for slightly different reasons. I used to enjoy just 'knocking about' on the dance floor. The first step away from that was starting to compete and having a regular dance partner. It started getting harder to get a kick out of club dancing from then on in though I did start enjoying the weekenders more. However, I then finally got exiled to London and became a member of the Jango crew. A combination of Kate & Will's teaching, the Kenobe music and the standard of the other dancers showed me a level of dancing that I hadn't realised was possible with MJ.

The only problem is ... there was no way back once I came back to the real world, back to the North West. Try as I might, the bland music, the lack of experienced female dancers and instructors meant that I couldn't get the interest back in dancing :( Do I wish could still enjoy the local club dancing .. Yes! Would I have preferred not to look into the 'promised land' to achieve that ... not sure. The ideal would be for 'centres of excellence' to exist throughout the UK. The sad truth is that outside a few clubs in the South East, despite the vacuous claims of some, such clubs don't exist ... though I'd love to be proved wrong on that.:wink:

[David Bailey]

When you're talking about a dance form - for example, AT - there are four stages of learning (as described in this article) (http://www.tejastango.com/effortless_mastery.html)

Unconscious incompetence: you don't know what you're doing wrong.
Conscious incompetence: you know what you're doing wrong
Conscious competence: you can do it right with effort.
Unconscious competence: you can do it right without effort.


So, if it's any consolation, you're not alone.

I've also reached a plateau / boredom stage with MJ. I look around me at an average Ceroc night, and know what is achievable elsewhere - and frankly, it's depressing how much of a gap there is between the two. So put me down in the "hotshot" camp too.

[Gus]

I look around me at an average Ceroc night, and know what is achievable elsewhere - and frankly, it's depressing how much of a gap there is between the two. Achieveable where?? Monday Jango was a real find. No doubt there are other pockets of MJ that can keep people interested ... but where are they? By definition they won't be at Ceroc clubs as Ceroc (tm) is aimed at the masses. I've not interest in other dance styles as they don't allow me to dance to the range of dance that MJ does. The possible exception is WCS and I really SUCK at it :(

[Gav]

I've also reached a plateau / boredom stage with MJ. I look around me at an average Ceroc night, and know what is achievable elsewhere - and frankly, it's depressing how much of a gap there is between the two. So put me down in the "hotshot" camp too.

Why do you have to be in the hotshot camp for that?

I know I've ruined my enjoyment of local dancing by travelling around to places where the standards are higher. But at the same time I'm not claiming to be better than local dancers. I just look around me and think that for the 2 or 3 excellent followers here, there would have been 20 - 30 of the same standard elsewhere, not to mention the handful who're in a totally different league.

I feel the same at local Ceroc nights DJ, but there are better dancers than I there. Just because I'd rather go to a freestyle where the standards are much higher doesn't make me a hotshot does it?

[dance cat]

For me the frustration is about progressing further but not wanting to use the routes on offer. For me dancing is about a connection with the music and who I'm dancing with. It's one of the best ways of achieving a pure state of happiness. I want to be a better dancer but the only routes on offer are workshops on competition performance and drops.

[David Bailey]

Achieveable where??
Dome, Wednesday evenings, Tufnell Park.

Although:

I've not interest in other dance styles as they don't allow me to dance to the range of dance that MJ does.(
I'm not sure that's true - I'll let you know for sure in 8 years and 10 months (when I progress beyond beginner stage in AT)


I feel the same at local Ceroc nights DJ, but there are better dancers than I there. Just because I'd rather go to a freestyle where the standards are much higher doesn't make me a hotshot does it?
I was at Hammersmith last night, and even in the Blues Room there was very little excellent dancing (forumites excepted of course, you're all lovely). There were some great examples of women who looked (physically) gorgeous, but frankly wouldn't know a break if it hit them, and far too much bouncing.

As for the main room - well, the phrase "Seventh Circle Of Hell" described it pretty well for me.

[Trouble]

For me the frustration is about progressing further but not wanting to use the routes on offer. For me dancing is about a connection with the music and who I'm dancing with. It's one of the best ways of achieving a pure state of happiness. I want to be a better dancer but the only routes on offer are workshops on competition performance and drops.

:yeah: Dancing for me is about meeting people, dancing with them and achieving that beautiful connection that happens quite rarely but you feel that you have moved together wonderfully and had that moment with that person. Mind you, that could be one sided for all i know but as they say what you dont know can not hurt you. I think to go deeper into it, which i am threatening to do in 2007, by looking at my dancing, getting a regular partner and really concentrating on improving myself, could take away the edge but i dont think that moment you experience when dancing with certain people could ever be removed or loose its special quality regardless how long you dance for. Well for me it wont anyway. :flower:

[bigdjiver]

"When ignorance is bliss, tis folly to be wise."

I get most of my pleasure from the normal Ceroc crowd, and from knowing that if I can give them the first step I have given them the staircase, how far they climb is up to them.

"Only a fool would wish the night sky to be all stars."

[dance cat]

:yeah: Dancing for me is about meeting people, dancing with them and achieving that beautiful connection that happens quite rarely but you feel that you have moved together wonderfully and had that moment with that person. Mind you, that could be one sided for all i know but as they say what you dont know can not hurt you. I think to go deeper into it, which i am threatening to do in 2007, by looking at my dancing, getting a regular partner and really concentrating on improving myself, could take away the edge but i dont think that moment you experience when dancing with certain people could ever be removed or loose its special quality regardless how long you dance for. Well for me it wont anyway. :flower:

I know what you mean, there's a certain fear of spoiling your enjoyment by looking at dance more seriously.
At the risk of coming over all Jerry Maguire and coming up with a manifesto there are things that I want from dance that I'm not sure I can achieve.
Part of me looks back to a little girl who did ballet and was told she was too tall to carry on with dance. I wish I hadn't given up but there's no point doing that as I can't change it now. There are also times when I wish I lived in London and had access to the kinds of venues that just aren't available up here. I went to a jango Tjive once and really wish I had regular access to that kind of venue and that kind of music.
Dancing is an important part of my life purely for me and I want to improve purely for me. I love music and love the feeling you get when a track comes on and you just have to dance for the sheer enjoyment and pleasure it gives you. Dancing also has a kind of therapy role for me as it's one of the few times I can completely switch my mind off from a demanding job.
There are also increasingly times when I wish I had a regular dance partner but in the Northwest it seems people only have regular partners if they are in a relationship or want to do competitions. I have tried to find private dance lessons but was told all the teachers in the area were too busy so that route seems unavailable too.
There are people that I dance with and it makes me feel alive. There are people I enjoy dancing with because they are great fun. Sometimes there are dances that make me cross and sometimes there are dancers that make me cross. But I wouldn't be without dance in my life because it brings me so much.

[Lynn]

Gaining knowledge about how one 'should' be able to follow precisely, using the correct frame, tension, compression, floor pressure and visual leads, can make one too self critical. I know where you are coming from, I'm at that point in AT - I was simply floating after a few dances at Southport in June - it felt wonderful. Then I started to learn more and I've never quite achieved that 'high' again - because I'm much more self critical as I know what I should be doing. I'm sure I'll get back there again at some point.

Dancing with people who have the ability to unite you with them AND the music, is an exquisite experience, that once experienced, can never be forgotten and will always be aspired to but rarely achieved I dance every week with leads who simply aren't there yet and the occasional visitor to NI highlights this difference in leader experience. But what keeps my regular dancing fresh for me is that those leads are starting to get there. I can enjoy their discoveries and encourage them on their journey.

I'm envious of those who haven't yet experienced the weekender blues room phenomenon or those who are still making discoveries, as once experinced you can never go back. I think it depends on your dance 'diet'. If you have those wonderful experiences too often they can become ordinary and you seem to need better and better dances to get that wonderful connection. I've deliberately taken a 4 month 'weekender break' where I haven't been going away. I know that by Feb I'll really have an appetite for the Southport blues room experience. I'm already getting hungry. Sometimes a break means you can rediscover things anew.

Also, think carefully when embarking on learning a new dance style, or two, or three, as they can end up just being a constant source of frustration, as so few other people can do them. Yep, but that was MJ for me for years. And I was like that at times over the past year with AT, grabbing any opportunity I could at weekenders, frustrated if a suitable track came on and there was no-one to dance with. But I've managed to make some space for AT, getting on a tango weekend this year etc. So now I know that if a tango track comes on and there is no-one to dance AT with, that there will be other times, other nights, other dances to look forward to. So instead of getting frustrated when I can't get to dance the style I want, I think of it as a treat when I do.

I think I'm saying that it takes some work and some thought, but you can change your focus on what makes a good dance experience, reset your targets and aim to make the best of whatever dancing you are doing.

For me - There is more yet to discover. There are more heights to reach. I'm going forward.

[MartinHarper]

I've not interest in other dance styles as they don't allow me to dance to the range of dance that MJ does.

I'm not entirely sure what this means - is it a typo?


I want to be a better dancer but the only routes on offer are workshops on competition performance and drops.

Have you considered private lessons?

[TheTramp]

I'm not entirely sure what this means - is it a typo?

What? Gus make a typo?? :whistle:


Have you considered private lessons?

It's interesting that private lessons are so undersold in the UK. In Oz and NZ, my impression is that a lot more people take up private lessons in order to improve their dancing.

Personally, I'd say that a private lesson done well can be of far more benefit in aiding improvement than a workshop, and probably only cost slightly more for one person, or actually slightly less for two people. You can get feedback personal to you on tips to aid your dancing. And a whole hour dedicated to improving just you. Even in a 4 hour workshop limited to 10 couples, you still get much less time than that, and most of the moves/advice/instruction is given out on a general, rather than on a specific basis. You might get a few minutes here and there with the teacher, but nowhere near as much as a dedicated lesson.

When deciding on having one, I'd advise to approach a teacher who's style and expertise match the areas in which you want to improve. Asking a teacher who has a reputation for smooth blues how to dance better in a funky style, for example, is probably not going to help you much. Think about the lesson beforehand. Turning up with a general remit to turn you into a better dancer won't have as much benefit as turning up with specific things and areas of your dancing that you want to improve. If the teacher has to spend the first third of the time trying to work out what you need to work on, then that's just time wasted.

Finally, be prepared to accept the (constructive) advice. If you go along convinced that you know everything there is to know about multiple spinning (for example), and disregard out of hand any advice in that area, you're probably wasting your money. The whole reason for you being there is to be told how you need to improve. The teacher isn't there to tell you how wonderful you are! It can sometimes be a painful experience!

And also, be prepared to get worse before you get better. When you start working on areas, your dancing is likely to take a dip before the (hopefully) eventual rise, while you're thinking about things, and trying to assimilate them into what you do. Don't expect that having paid for one private lesson that you'll suddenly turn into world beaters. It still takes plenty of dedication and work!

[WittyBird]

~snip - inspirational - snip ~

Feel content with what you have while remaining hungry for some more.



I tried to rep you for this *wow* what wonderful thoughts and fantastic sentiments :respect: This is one of the *few* worthwhile reasons for reading now.



North West. Try as I might, the bland music, the lack of experienced female dancers and instructors meant that I couldn't get the interest back in dancing

Don't you teach & DJ in the North West? :whistle:
Just wondered :eek:



I know I've ruined my enjoyment of local dancing by travelling around to places where the standards are higher.
Big fish, tiny puddle.



I was at Hammersmith last night, and even in the Blues Room there was very little excellent dancing (forumites excepted of course, you're all lovely).

Easy Tiger :rolleyes:


:yeah: Dancing for me is about meeting people, dancing with them and achieving that beautiful connection that happens quite rarely

:yeah: :respect:
Let go and relax.:D


What? Gus make a typo?? :whistle:


Surely not no, really? :whistle: :innocent:

[WittyBird]

I have found there is a sad price to pay for experiencing the best of the best


What is that sad price? The fact that you're so unique and special you've picked it up so quickly, but are so willing to pass it on to others?

Pray tell?



The naivity of not being aware of my inherent faults, gave me a confidence that i've since lost..

But you always seem to have the inate ability to pass that confidence on to others :respect:




Gaining knowledge about how one 'should' be able to follow precisely, using the correct frame, tension, compression, floor pressure and visual leads, can make one too self critical.


You've got nothing to be critical of IMO :worthy:



Watching video's of perfectly executed choreographed routines, gives unrealistic goals to aim at.


No, I disagree, It gives pleasure, it also gives you the opportunity to steal a few little quirks :wink:




I'm envious of those who haven't yet experienced the weekender blues room phenomenon or those who are still making discoveries, as once experinced you can never go back..


No you can't go back, but you can go forwards. Go without expectations, relax and take each new experience as they come.




Also, think carefully when embarking on learning a new dance style, or two, or three, as they can end up just being a constant source of frustration, as so few other people can do them.

That's why it's better to learn one at a time. Relax, gain confidence and move forwards, whilst taking each new thing learnt into every new experience.

I'm really surprised at you Lory......

For one you have been (and still are) an inspiration to me. If it hadn't been for you and a few others who I respect and admire, I wouldn't be the person I am today.

You have coached, inspired, criticised, praised and welcomed me into the life that is dance. I wish I could give you some of the motivation and inspiration that you've given me in the last year or so.

If you're feeling like this God help the rest of us.

[dance cat]

Have you considered private lessons?


I have tried to find private dance lessons but was told all the teachers in the area were too busy so that route seems unavailable too.


seems you missed this part of my post.

[Gav]

The naivity of not being aware of my inherent faults, gave me a confidence that i've since lost.

But you always seem to have the inate ability to pass that confidence on to others :respect:


:yeah: :yeah: :yeah:

I've told you before Lory, but I've only bumped into you twice and you know how much my confidence improved over the evening. Each time we danced I got more confident and therefore better and that was down to you. Your dancing, smiling and encouraging comments gave me that extra confidence.



I have tried to find private dance lessons but was told all the teachers in the area were too busy so that route seems unavailable too.

seems you missed this part of my post.

:yeah: Except when a friend and I approached our local Ceroc franchise we were told that "we don't do private lessons".

[fletch]

I know what you mean, there's a certain fear of spoiling your enjoyment by looking at dance more seriously.
QUOTE]

I have just come out of a confidence moment.

while at Oxford this Friday, Roy said 'Fletch' we will grab a dance in a bit' my reply was, 'i'm not doing so good at the moment go easy on me'

he said 'why do you want to go professional' ?

NO

'do you want to compete'?

NO

'No, your a social dancer, just having fun, why have you started taking it so serious'?

'Fletch don't ever change'

and I think it was that I have been dancing with such good dancer. teachers, etc., that there expectations of me, are that I should be moving on faster, thus putting pressure on myself to be better, and when i'm not, feeling like a let down. :sad:

I dance to have fun, chat, make friends, laugh, dress up, and yes dance.

Back on track

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[QUOTE=TheTramp;321527]What? Gus make a typo?? :whistle:

















Surely not no, really? :whistle: :innocent:

will you two stop picking on Gus you know how sensitive he can be :mad: :wink:





No, I disagree, It gives pleasure, it also gives you the opportunity to steal a few little quirks :wink:


No you can't go back, but you can go forwards. Go without expectations, relax and take each new experience as they come.


That's why it's better to learn one at a time. Relax, gain confidence and move forwards, whilst taking each new thing learnt into every new experience.


For one you have been (and still are) an inspiration to me. If it hadn't been for you and a few others who I respect and admire, I wouldn't be the person I am today.

You have coached, inspired, criticised, praised and welcomed me into the life that is dance. I wish I could give you some of the motivation and inspiration that you've given me in the last year or so.

.

and Witty all these comment you made to Lorry are mine to you :flower:

I love your little quriks, but you are you, i'm neaver going to be you, I need to find my own quirks...one day......untill then I will carry on flitting arount the room been Cilla Black :na:


'hello whats your name and where do you come from' ? :hug:

[Feelingpink]

...

I've also reached a plateau / boredom stage with MJ. I look around me at an average Ceroc night, and know what is achievable elsewhere - and frankly, it's depressing how much of a gap there is between the two. So put me down in the "hotshot" camp too.:yeah: It's why I don't dance MJ any more. :sad: I went to a Greenwich party night a few months ago and had a nice enough time with people I like :wink: - but no urge to go back - and at the last one I would have had a lovely escort ... it just isn't enough. So ... need to find another way into tango in the new year.

[Groovemeister]

I am glad this thread came up because it is how I have felt for a while. I am not bored with "Ceroc" though.

I have a dance partner which makes all the difference for me I know that when I have had enough of dancing the "Ceroc tm" way I can go to her and dance the way we want to.

It helps me get the best of both worlds dancing with a wide variety of people and having fun but with musical expression and dancing freedom when I want it.

I do get critical though and I can see a point where that might kill it for me but I have my oasis in the desert.

This is the general problem with MJ though in that if you have no other dance experience it does take you down the road of dance mediocrity the good thing is though if you want to learn more it is a good base to start with.

[Geordieed]

One of the lessons reading Lory's initial post is 'Be careful of what you wish for'.

I know exactly how you feel Lory. Speaking for myself I also feel like a beginner again. It does get better but if you keep feeding yourself with knowledge you will keep on this sort of cycle. Like they say dancing can be a drug and when you look at it you're looking for new highs to feed the addiction unfortunately.

Even this year the extra knowledge picked up has been so specialist I wonder sometimes if I should carry on or not.

[Clive Long]

<< snip >> The ideal would be for 'centres of excellence' to exist throughout the UK.
Gus,

As I always, I disagree completely with your view on ranking and judging everything in life and finding it all comes up short and leaves you dissatisfied.

I would much rather

The ideal would be for 'centres of enjoyment' to exist throughout the UK.


The sad truth is that outside a few clubs in the South East, despite the vacuous claims of some, such clubs don't exist ... though I'd love to be proved wrong on that.:wink:
Oooh. So much material to shoot at in such a small space.

Please provide some evidence for your rather sweeping statement.

Clive

[marty_baby]

No you can't go back, but you can go forwards. Go without expectations, relax and take each new experience as they come.

That's why it's better to learn one at a time. Relax, gain confidence and move forwards, whilst taking each new thing learnt into every new experience.

I'm really surprised at you Lory......

For one you have been (and still are) an inspiration to me. If it hadn't been for you and a few others who I respect and admire, I wouldn't be the person I am today.

You have coached, inspired, criticised, praised and welcomed me into the life that is dance. I wish I could give you some of the motivation and inspiration that you've given me in the last year or so.

If you're feeling like this God help the rest of us.


Wow... I'm impressed Witty!

Very deep and introspective. Have a Rep - I don't give those out all that often!

martin :hug:

[Lory]

Well, firstly a huge thank you to all of you who've responded to my initial post and to the people who've PM'd and spoken to me in person too and just in case anyone 'else' thinks i'm suicidal :really: or about to pack it all in, I'm not, honestly! :wink:

I think we all occasionally go through little phases of wondering where we're heading and what our real goal is or should we even have one :confused:

And, I also think we all have the occasional bout of 'badnightitus' syndrome :tears: where you come home thinking, I'm getting worse, not better :eek: :sick: or when the music just doesn't seem to hit the spot or your partners (even though they might be competent) don't match 'your' idea of how you'd like to interpret the music and everything just feels 'odd':sad:

Anyway, the good news is, I had fun last night and defintiely feel like my Mojo has a bit more life in it! :clap: :cheers:


I can enjoy almost all the dances I have to whatever music. I think that it must be different for followers though :hug:Tis true, it is different for followers ;)

Interestingly the guy doesn't have to be good, flash or even be past the beginner phase......

I suppose what it really comes down to, is the guy's ability to make 'me' feel good about 'me' :blush: in the same way, that I'd try to encourage 'him' to feel good about 'himself'. :cheers:



1. Learn dances that other people dance. Salsa, not Outer Hebridean Three Step.
~snip~
3. Try not to consider one dance as "better" than another.
:yeah: I don't think any that i'm learning are that unusual, although, your right, I'm definitely expecting too much from an ordinary MJ night, hoping that they'd be lots of other men, who can do 'AT', Cha cha and WCS.
I've never thought one dance was better than another but now I'm learning the different styles, when I hear music that calls out for a certain dance, at that moment, i'd rather be doing the dance i've learnt, that reflects the genre!

Also, I have to admit, the idea of a 'whole night' of AT, or a whole night of Ballroom doesn't fill me with joy either! Fussy cow, arent' I? (don't answer that!!!)


Use your enthusiasm for your newly preferred dancestyles to encourage others and help to build up the numbers who will enjoy that which you enjoy.
:yeah:


it works differently for different people: 'X' may be regarded as a great dancer for most people, but for 'Z' it just doesn't happen when dancing with 'X':

:yeah: Very true.


Lot's of interesting stuff that i'm still digesting! ;)


I know what you mean, there's a certain fear of spoiling your enjoyment by looking at dance more seriously.
Exactly! :cool:


You have coached, inspired, criticised, praised and welcomed me into the life that is dance. I wish I could give you some of the motivation and inspiration that you've given me in the last year or so.
You just have! :hug:


Each time we danced I got more confident and therefore better and that was down to you. Your dancing, smiling and encouraging comments gave me that extra confidence.
It wasn't just one sided Gav! :flower: :hug:

[dave the scaffolder]

:yeah: Dancing for me is about meeting people, dancing with them and achieving that beautiful connection that happens quite rarely but you feel that you have moved together wonderfully and had that moment with that person. Mind you, that could be one sided for all i know but as they say what you dont know can not hurt you. I think to go deeper into it, which i am threatening to do in 2007, by looking at my dancing, getting a regular partner and really concentrating on improving myself, could take away the edge but i dont think that moment you experience when dancing with certain people could ever be removed or loose its special quality regardless how long you dance for. Well for me it wont anyway. :flower:
I am yours to dance with forever i presume you are talking about me ME ME ME FOCUS ON ME ME ME I am not well you know xxx:clap: