Snubbing the snubbers???

[Aleks]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
exclusive dancer ? i take it thats someone who has a short list of people who they would dance with - so dont bother asking them if youre not on it?

That's about right. My boyfriend started dancing about six months ago. I had assumed (wrongly) that my female buddies would give him 4 minutes of their time most weeks to encourage his not inconsiderable effort. Most of them did, but I was amazed when 3 or 4 of them totally blanked him. One even turned her back as he was asking her to dance..... but then wanted to chat in the pub later.

Now that he's a much larger repertoire of moves and is more confident they're more prepared to dance and he faces the dilemma of whether to return the snub or disregard their rudeness. What would you do?

[Wendy]

Originally posted by Aleks
he faces the dilemma of whether to return the snub or disregard their rudeness. What would you do? Probably forgive and forget. He could be missing out on some great dances. I used to feel that I was a total muppet with some guys - they made me feel really stupid if I "made a mistake". I wouldn't snub them if they asked me now although I wouldn't be in a rush to ask them. And some of them are now amongst my favourite dancers. I have never turned down a dance and if I have I have always tried to ask them back later in the evening (listen to little miss perfect eh !!). The only person I am ready to say "no" to is the Sleazeman we spoke about on another thread. And I think I'd still find that hard to do.

Wxxx

[Gadget]

Originally posted by Aleks
I had assumed (wrongly) that all of my female buddies would give him 4 mins of their time once a week, so he could practice dancing with someone other than myself and encourage his not inconsiderable efforts. MOST of them did, but I was really surprised at the total disregard he faced by 3 or 4 of them. Now that he's more confident and has a bigger repertoire of moves, they'll ask him to dance. He is now faced with the dilemma of snubbing them back, or pretending they weren't rude six months ago.
Do you mean turned down for a dance, or did he just want to practice?
Personally, I would be fairly cruel and dance a couple of rounds of the beginners moves with them (as taught that night), then ask them if they remembered turning me down, and if suitably embarassed, would then broaden the repertoir and add some flair (if not embarassed, then I can always use the dance to improve the basics...)
Perhaps a bit subtle for some? But if they comment, then you can just say that that was the dance that they turned you down for earlier; if they want a dance now however...

[TheTramp]

Originally posted by Aleks
That's about right. My boyfriend started dancing about six months ago. I had assumed (wrongly) that my female buddies would give him 4 minutes of their time most weeks to encourage his not inconsiderable effort. Most of them did, but I was amazed when 3 or 4 of them totally blanked him. One even turned her back as he was asking her to dance..... but then wanted to chat in the pub later.

Now that he's a much larger repertoire of moves and is more confident they're more prepared to dance and he faces the dilemma of whether to return the snub or disregard their rudeness. What would you do? Okie. Here's my own method. I will never ask anyone more than twice if they turn me down. First time, fair enough, I know what it's like, when I need a drink, my knee hurts, whatever. Second time, I'm starting to feel that they don't want to dance with me. If they change their minds in the future, they can come and ask me.

As for what he should do. Well, he should accept if they ask him. I don't know whether they remember rejecting him previously, but if he accepts graciously with a smile on his face, then he's just showing up their behaviour, and not sinking down to their level. I don't ever like saying 'no' without a good reason. And if I do, I usually try to find that person as soon as possible, and ask them - although, sometimes this just isn't possible....

Steve

[Dreadful Scathe]

Originally posted by Gadget
Do you mean turned down for a dance, or did he just want to practice?

? I would consider every dance as practice until Im perfect :D , so I'm not sure what you mean!

As for being snubbed - I would still dance with that person in the future - remember...you are not them, YOU didnt snub anyone and you don't want to be the sort of person that does. You can only hope people like that learn the error of their ways. Lifes too short to bear grudges.

Why can't we all just get along :)

[Dave Hancock]

Originally posted by Aleks

they're more prepared to dance and he faces the dilemma of whether to return the snub or disregard their rudeness. What would you do?

Personally I would still dance with them as I live to give:waycool:

[Aleks]

Originally posted by Gadget
Do you mean turned down for a dance, or did he just want to practice?

They turned down a dance - and he'd already mastered all the beginners moves! The funny thing was that the same woman saw him dancing a few weeks ago and couldn't get to him fast enough to say, "you've got good now - would you like to dance?". He made water/toilet excuses.....and has deliberately not asked since.

Maybe it's just because I'm a taxi, but I believe that everyone should be encouraged. Four minutes out of a night is a small percentage of your dance time. Even if you only dance with ONE beginner per week......

These are the good dancers of the future....

[Chicklet]

Originally posted by Dreadful Scathe
Why can't we all just get along :) cos some or us are short.:rofl:

seriously completely agree and lovely to see that rise above it, it's their loss in the long run is the most common view.

And maybe that's one of the reasons this forum thing works too, because basically, underneath it all, we are all quite nice and we DO get along.

Going right back to the start, Alexs (maybe they are but I'm guessing not) do you think your friends would have acted differently had they been exposed to all this?

I can feel that I'm about to get Francked into another thread but


Chicken and egg type question

Do(es) this forum and these discussions work well because we were all nice people before we got here or are we developing into nice people, interested in considering, debating and respecting other views because we're getting the chance to do so?


I have an opinion but I'll save it for now and see the others first.



:D

[TheTramp]

I'm not nice. I'm mean, evil and nasty. Wendy will corroborate this for me.

Steve

[Wendy]

Originally posted by TheTramp
I'm not nice. I'm mean, evil and nasty. Wendy will corroborate this for me. And it takes one to know one grrrrr !!!!!nasty face, frown, scowl and snubbing by the minute !!!

Wx (exclusive clique bitch extraordinaire)

PS Oh yes and my other business card reads :

"PVC-Clad Pole Dancer - POA" - if anyone's interested ??

[Aleks]

Originally posted by Chicklet
do you think your friends would have acted differently had they been exposed to all this?

Exposed to what?
(I didn't call them friends, I called them dance-buddies!)
If they had been snubbed themselves.....don't know and don't really care. If they had been snubbed in the past, all the more reason not to do it to someone else! I just found their behaviour incredibly rude.

[Chicklet]

Originally posted by TheTramp
I'm not nice. I'm mean, evil and nasty. Wendy will corroborate this for me.
Steve

Steve, just cos someone bought you a t-shirt with this on it once does NOT necessarily make it TRUE!!!

We see right thru it - which means it must have been a see thru t-shirt :eek: :kiss:

[Rachel]

Originally posted by Aleks
They turned down a dance - and he'd already mastered all the beginners moves! The funny thing was that the same woman saw him dancing a few weeks ago and couldn't get to him fast enough to say, "you've got good now - would you like to dance?". He made water/toilet excuses.....and has deliberately not asked since.

Maybe it's just because I'm a taxi, but I believe that everyone should be encouraged. Four minutes out of a night is a small percentage of your dance time. Even if you only dance with ONE beginner per week......

These are the good dancers of the future.... Oh dear, I'm obviously not as nice as everyone else on this forum, cos I was going to say ' snub them as they snubbed him!' Ok, maybe not be deliberately rude, but if you can conveniently avoid them for an evening, I'd do that.

I'm totally with you, 4 minutes out of a week is nothing, and it's hardly that bad dancing with beginners anyway, is it! Those girls sound awful if they wouldn't even do that. And I guess I'm awful for bearing (hypothetical) grudges.

And for once, I have to disagree with Wendy to some extent about how he might be missing out on some great dances - is it possible to have great dances with people you dislike? I honestly can't imagine that.

Ooops, maybe I'd just better slink away and hide now ... Honestly, if you all of you who've responded mean what you say, I stand in total awe and admiration of you!! You're right, it's how we should be - I'm just so far far far away from perfect...

Tramp - I think I need to take on your 'mean evil and nasty' mantle now, cos obviously no-one believes it of you!
Rachel

[Graham]

Originally posted by Rachel
Oh dear, I'm obviously not as nice as everyone else on this forum, ........Tramp, I think I need to take on your 'mean evil and nasty' mantle now I'm glad you've finally come out of the closet, Rachel - now we can all stop talking about it behind your back. :wink: :devil:

I think one's behaviour is likely to depend on how much one had been hurt by being snubbed as well as on how nice a person one is.

Personally my approach is somewhat like Steve's. If someone does/says something hurtful I'd probably not ask them (depending on whether I was sure they were being mean and whether I remembered), but I'd accept if they asked me.

[Lou]

Originally posted by Aleks
and he faces the dilemma of whether to return the snub or disregard their rudeness. What would you do? In his position, I would not turn down a dance, if asked - however, I wouldn't ask these ladies for a dance, when I might actively seek out & ask others (if you see what I mean?).:devil:

[DavidB]

There is one lady who has now turned me down 3 times (every time I have asked her). I'm not alone - I know several very good dancers who have been turned down by her as well. She just seems to be extremely picky who she dances with.

Generally it is now quite easy for me - I just completely ignore her, and will never bother ask her to dance again. But I don't know what I would do if she asked me to dance (as she tends to do to other men.) Part of me would love to say 'no' - as I don't think that has ever happened to her. But the other part of me says 'Never turn down an invitation to dance.'

----------------------------------------------------------------

Occasionally you get ladies who, despite their best intentions and endeavours, are just not very good at following. (I think ladies get a similar problem a lot with men who can't lead.) In this case I will never turn down a dance, because the only way they will get better is with practice. But I might actively seek them out when it is a song that I don't like...

David

[Gadget]

Originally posted by DavidB
Occasionally you get ladies who, despite their best intentions and endeavours, are just not very good at following. (I think ladies get a similar problem a lot with men who can't lead.) In this case I will never turn down a dance, because the only way they will get better is with practice. But I might actively seek them out when it is a song that I don't like...
Ooooh :what: and I thought you were nice :really: Only dancing with beginners to music you don't like... tisk tisk :devil:

[DavidB]

Originally posted by Gadget
Only dancing with beginners to music you don't like... tisk tisk Who said anything about beginners?

Beginners are fun to dance with. They have hardly seen any of moves before, so you can still impress them with a yo-yo. You will probably be the first person ever to 'hit a break' while dancing with them. And you can almost guarantee a beginner is noticably better at the end of the dance than at the start. You never get that rate of improvement again.

David

[LilyB]

Originally posted by DavidB
.. She just seems to be extremely picky who she dances with............ it is now quite easy for me - I just completely ignore her, and will never bother ask her to dance again. But I don't know what I would do if she asked me to dance (as she tends to do to other men.) Just say to her "I'd love to but my wife won't allow me" :na: :D :wink:

LilyB

[Basil Brush (Forum Plant)]

Originally posted by Aleks
(I didn't call them friends, I called them dance-buddies!)


I find there's a lot of that at ceroc, superficial friendships.

Everyone is so HAPPY :D :D :D which is nice, but if you're a bit low it makes you worse:tears:

[Twinkle Toes]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Aleks
... he faces the dilemma of whether to return the snub or disregard their rudeness. What would you do?

Personally, I have only ever said no to sleazies and don't mind dancing with old/young/complete beginners ( in fact it can be very amusing and rewarding) However, I have had a couple of occasions where I have been turned down and like Steve, he got a second chance but not a third.

But since I'm a bit cheeky, I now deliberately go up to the person standing next to him, (regardless of how good/ bad dancer they are) and ask them instead. It works a treat, cause he always thinks I'm heading for him, but at the last minute I ask the other person.
You should see some of the looks I've got from that move ... and I must admit, I always feel quite smug after it. :na:

TT

[TheTramp]

Nah. A much better option is to go find someone that you dance with really well, and then go and dance in front of the person who turned you down.

I'd say about 50% of the time, they then come up and ask me to dance :D

Steve

[Sheepman]

Nice one Steve, but you know that not all of us can get the attention from the audience like you (we haven't signed that pact with Beelzebub!), so your method could fall flat.

And what about those partner(s) who feel like they are snubbing you even WHILE you are dancing?

Greg

[Divissima]

The splendid Greg wrote:And what about those partner(s) who feel like they are snubbing you even WHILE you are dancing?I know what you mean - there's one man in particular in London whose style and attitude on the dancefloor I admire greatly and who danced in the same venue as me for a long time. On two occasions, after watching him dance dazzling moves and with fantastic musicality with two or three women in a row, I plucked up the courage to ask him to dance, and he spent the dance leading very simplistic moves with a bored expression on his face - he didn't give me a chance to show what I could do. I don't know if I'd have been more upset if he had turned me down flat, but it certainly felt like an insult that he didn't seem to even try to enjoy himself...

[Rachel]

Originally posted by Graham
I'm glad you've finally come out of the closet, Rachel - now we can all stop talking about it behind your back. :wink: :devil:
Oh but I thought I'd been hiding it so well!!

Actually I'm getting some really good ideas from this thread - especially what Twinkle Toes was saying: 'But since I'm a bit cheeky, I now deliberately go up to the person standing next to him, (regardless of how good/ bad dancer they are) and ask them instead. It works a treat, cause he always thinks I'm heading for him, but at the last minute I ask the other person.'

I love that!
Rachel

[Jon]

When I was a beginner in the class I got partnered with a woman who clearly wouldnt even try to help me with the intermediate moves and looked so uninterested and was basically just standing there. Then a couple of weeks later I asked her for a dance and she accepted, proceeded to walk into the middle of the floor with me then made an excuse before we'd even started dancing and walked off leaving me standing there like a lemon.

That experience really knocked my confidence for ages. Then I saw her at the champs this year and all I can say is I really dont know what I saw in her dancing back then so that sort of cheered me up and the fact that I got further than her :grin:

So moral of the story, dont say no to beginners since they are tomorrows best dancers and you will want to dance with them.

[PeterL]

just a note of caution here.

we all say no at some time and we should accept no without taking offence, we don't know what has just happened to the person who said no.

there mum might have died they may be feeling ill, anything.

it is only if someone says no repeatedly that we should stop asking them.

there was one taxi dancer who said no to me 15 times in a row and I was no begginer, I think she just doesn't like the way I dance.

You could say who can blame her. :rolleyes:

[Gadget]

Originally posted by PeterL
there was one taxi dancer who said no to me 15 times in a row and I was no begginer, I think she just doesn't like the way I dance.
Was she actually on taxi duty when you asked?

There is a woman that the first time I danced with her she seemed very distant or disgusted - but I think that was on the penultimate track of the evening and my back was rather damp. {:sorry::sick:} Subsequent dances with the same lady have had a lot more 'connection'.

[PeterL]

no I know the rule about when they are taxiing they are not supposed to dance with anyone but begginers.

I even got turned down by her at parties.

but that isn't the point I'm making. the point is not to take offence if someone says no once or twice give them a chance to ask you next time maybe, but don't take offence too soon you don't know what is happening in there lives.

[Rachel]

Originally posted by PeterL
but that isn't the point I'm making. the point is not to take offence if someone says no once or twice give them a chance to ask you next time maybe, but don't take offence too soon you don't know what is happening in there lives. Yes, but there's different ways of saying 'no', isn't there? If there's any hint of an apology, or good reason, then, fine, fair enough.
Rachel

[Rachel]

Originally posted by Divissima
I don't know if I'd have been more upset if he had turned me down flat, but it certainly felt like an insult that he didn't seem to even try to enjoy himself... That's why it's taken me 5 or 6 years to get up the nerve to ask men to dance - not so much scared they'd say no, as scared they'd say yes but wouldn't enjoy it at all!! To not even try and look as if you're enjoying a dance is horrible.

Particularly with newer people, or people I don't know, I have a policy (think it comes from the work I do training ) of trying to say at least one good thing about the dance/someone's dancing when the music stops - 'I loved that walk-around move you did', 'you lead really well' etc etc. Just about everyone's got something they do nicely.

PS. Greg - welcome to the forum!!
Rachel

[Gadget]

There is a lady that frequents my regular night whom I have seen/heard some animosity towards. This is because she tries to dance above her abilities: attends the intermediate class when she clearly struggles with following the beginner moves and asks more experienced dancers to dance, then can’t follow the fairly simple moves.
It doesn’t matter the reason behind her choice – probably that she enjoys every moment of dance – but I have heard comments that “no-one likes dancing with her” and ‘oh-no’ comments when some men see she is dancing.

Q: Is this attitude justified?

{I have danced with the lady in question on several occasions – my opinion is that she needs to stop trying to anticipate moves; she currently knows too few and confuses the lead by trying to complete moves she knows instead of relaxing and going with any variations. In classes I am fine when running through moves with her – it’s only after a rotation when stringing moves together or going with a count that I have to concentrate really hard with her: In these situations, it helps me find areas of the moves that could go squiffy when they are done in freestyle.}

[Rachel]

Originally posted by Gadget
There is a lady that frequents my regular night whom I have seen/heard some animosity towards. This is because she tries to dance above her abilities: attends the intermediate class when she clearly struggles with following the beginner moves and asks more experienced dancers to dance, then can’t follow the fairly simple moves.
It doesn’t matter the reason behind her choice – probably that she enjoys every moment of dance – but I have heard comments that “no-one likes dancing with her” and ‘oh-no’ comments when some men see she is dancing.

Q: Is this attitude justified? Well, it's hard to stop yourself thinking 'oh no!' on the odd occasion, but you shouldn't really verbalise comments like that. (Though girl-to-girl bitching in the toilets is different and quite justified! [Joking!!])

I suppose the good thing, at least, is that her dancing should imrpove very quickly if she's dancing with the good guys so often. However, the guys should really be dancing to her ability and treating her more like a beginner.

That's what feels so fantastic about Viktor. (Did I tell you all/the whole world that I've finally got to dance with Viktor??? And, yes, he really is as good as they say - in all ways!) Rather than trying to impress you with all his flashy moves, it feels like he's dancing for you - to your stengths/ability (and limitations!).
Rachel

[TheTramp]

Rachel posted:
Just about everyone's got something they do nicely.I always try to ask nicely. It goes downhill very quickly from there though! :na:

Steve

[Rachel]

Originally posted by TheTramp
I always try to ask nicely. It goes downhill very quickly from there though! :na:

Steve And you've got a lovely smile and give great hugs! Oh the dancing ... well, that's not too bad!!
R.

[Wendy]

Originally posted by Rachel
And you've got a lovely smile and give great hugs! Plus a really sexy "hello" on the phone....kisses are pretty good too - oops G will never let me go to Camber by myself again at this rate !!!:innocent:

Wxxx

[TheTramp]

:sorry

Steve

[Rachel]

Originally posted by Wendy
oops G will never let me go to Camber by myself again at this rate !!!:innocent:

Wxxx Actually, I'm very surprised he didn't insist on coming, too. Did he really prefer not to come to Camber, or was there only 1 spare ticket, or perhaps you just didn't ask him?

Graham?

[Graham]

Originally posted by Rachel
Actually, I'm very surprised he didn't insist on coming, too. Did he really prefer not to come to Camber, or was there only 1 spare ticket, or perhaps you just didn't ask him?

Graham? Wendy's decision was very last-minute. I had taken last week off work, but I was due back on Monday, and I knew that if I went I'd just be knackered this week, so decided to just stay at home and chill out. But I intend to go to dance weekends in future - we're already booked on Beach Boogie.

[Sheepman]

Hi Graham, look forward to meeting you at Beach Boogie, and swapping Wendys!:D


Originally posted by Rachel
PS. Greg - welcome to the forum!!
Thanks for that, and the wonderful things you said re the champs, but you realise I will be in big trouble if I spend too much time doing this!

Originally posted by Divissima leading very simplistic moves with a bored expression on his face
I don't know why, but there are just a few partners or times, where I just find it impossible to smile while dancing (those that know me will know this is very unusual - in our family my depressive brother's children have an expression - "go on Dad, do a Greg", ie get rid of the scowl :sad: and replace it with a big cheesy grin.) :grin: So why is it I can sometimes not look like I'm enjoying it, even though it may be a pretty good dance? Am I alone in this? There again, I hope my expression never goes as far as boredom.

Greg
PS I don't think I've ever been called Divine before, is this boost Greg's ego week or what? Much appreciated as I fight off the Camber bug, with no dancing since 5am last Monday.:tears:

[Graham]

Originally posted by Sheepman
Hi Graham, look forward to meeting you at Beach Boogie, and swapping Wendys!:D :really: :really: Gosh - didn't realise it was that sort of weekend! :wink: D'oh! Swing music - it's obvious now! :wink:

Looking forward to meeting you too! :grin:

[Andy McGregor]

Originally posted by Chicklet
Steve, just cos someone bought you a t-shirt with this on it once does NOT necessarily make it TRUE!!!

We see right thru it - which means it must have been a see thru t-shirt :eek: :kiss:

The t-shirt I made for Steve (with my own fair hands) said;

"Help, I'm a lesbian trapped in the body of a fat, ugly dancer"

Steve's answer was 'Less of the "dancer" if you please, I'm just a beginner'. Which goes to show what an all-around nice, modest guy he is.